"Why do some Christians teach that even though Jesus took our sins away from the sight of God, we still need to repent for them? Does not
the bible say that Jesus took our sins away forever, past, present, and future...?", (Question from Manny Ferreira).
Repentance is a big part of the salvation process, because as we approach the throne of God, our own faults and culpabilities are made apparent to us, "Him hath God exalted with his right
hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins" (Luke 24.47 KJV bible). When we come to recognize and repent for our sins, Christ washes them
away, making us new creatures in his name. But then after we are redeemed in Christ, should repentance continue to be a part of our daily lives? The answer is yes and no.
First, we should not seek forgiveness for things we've already repented for, because we are no longer in bondage to these "dead works", "Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine
of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God" (Hebrews 6.1 KJV bible). Paul refers to the sins of our old
self as dead works, because these sins are forgiven, and no longer relevant to our lives. He instructs us to move on past repentance from these old sins, and unto the meat of God's Word. This
doesn't mean that we shouldn't remember, or think about, or understand these dead works, but that we shouldn't ask to be forgiven from them again and again. Re-repentance from dead works is an
insult to Christ, because it implies that initially he did not fully heal us, and set us free from our sins.
On the other hand, as Christians we must always strive to maintain a humble and repentant disposition in Christ. The reality is that we are not perfect, and we will never be perfect. Only in
Christ are we perfected to be received by God as his children (Ephesians 1). As fallible people who inevitably sin, it's our responsibility to resist and war against sin to prevent it from further
manifesting in our lives. In Revelation, Jesus instructs the church of Sardis to repent from its sins, and turn back to him, "Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold
fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee" (Revelation 3.3 KJV bible). Many at Sardis had
become derelict and fallen away from the righteous path of Christ. So Jesus' rebuke serves as a warning for all Christians to discern and resist sin before it overtakes us.
Christ gives us eyes that see, so we can recognize our sins, and improve and work on ourselves. This striving to become more Christlike is a responsibility that we have as part of our
relationship with him, and not a gift like salvation, "For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed,
receiveth blessing from God: But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned" (Hebrews 6.7-8 KJV bible). In Christ, we are forgiven
from our sins, but if we refuse to recognize and confess our own sins and failings, we have rendered ourselves unusable for his purpose and plan.
Now this doesn't mean that the second a Christian sins they are out of the book, and no longer a Christian. Our inevitable sins our washed clean if we believe in and follow Christ. What is does
mean is that it's not okay for us to sin, so we have to war against it in Christ, "What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are
dead to sin, live any longer therein?" (Romans 6.1-2 KJV bible). So it is the willful and habitual sinner, living in sin, whom the wrath of God will be upon when Christ returns to reign
Diego 22 Mar 2011, 14:44
You mention "...we shouldn't ask to be forgiven from them again and again.
Re-repentance from dead works is an insult to Christ, because it implies
that initially he did not fully heal us, and set us free from our sins."
So say in my case, as I have an addiction to masturbation, I have a really
guilty conscience after I commit this sin and I confess it. I wish to be
turned away from this sin, but I find myself stumbling time and again. Was
I fully healed the first time I repented? Shouldn't I continue to confess?
Doug Buckley 23 Mar 2011, 16:41
Hi Diego, that's a pretty good question. When you're "healed" from your
sins and dead works it doesn't mean that you'll never be tempted to sin
again. Instead, it means that you're free from the spiritual damage that
those sins are causing. The sins are washed away so you are no longer being
cursed and corrupted by them.
Being a Christian doesn't mean that you aren't tempted to sin and don't
sin. We all sin everyday, especially with little things like coveting
things or being angry etc. You just have to keep fighting to not sin, and
Jesus will forgive you your sins, everyday. So yes, confess, recognize that
you've sinned, and recommit youself. Just don't keep repenting for the
things you did a long time ago and have already repented for, which is
acting like you haven't been forgiven.
Part of becoming a mature Christian is knowing the sorts of triggers and
false thinking that pulls us back into our old habits, and learning to nip
things in the bud, before we get sucked into things we know are wrong. God
Ryan 24 Apr 2011, 23:47
C'mon guys, really?! We are to be Grace-Focused, not Sin-Focused. As a guy
that has already gone through the teenage stage full of raging hormones and
struggles with pornography, greed and other worldly temptations, I can say
that I feel your pain Diego. Once Jesus gave his life to heal our sick and
dying condition, we were set free from the fear of committing sin and God's
wrath that would inevitably follow. Diego your comment reminds me of a
part of my life where I was definately still a babe in Christ. I wanted to
do what was right and do kingdom work, however I was stuck in a rut and
never-ending cycle of fear and guilt. I would fall into sin and then
immediately after that sin I would ask for God's forgiveness fearful that
he would strike me down or cause bad things to happen in my life if I did
not repent to Him immediately. Did I have an understanding of the Grace
that I had received years prior? Absolutely not! I was taught to Fear God
as a literal fear like he was this guy just waiting to punish me if I was
bad. That is what we are taught in society due to the Dark Ages of
Christianity. However to Fear God in true translation of the word is a
term that means to respect God. We are taught in church that God is like
an earthly father. We are taught here that any good father disciplines his
children. However, after Christ rose from the dead, his blood paid the
price of any "old covenent" punishment for sins. I'm not saying that there
aren't natural consequences to sin. Sure if you fornicate enough with
multiple partners, eventually you will contract a disease. But God does
not punish us as he did those before the cross, thanks to the sacrifice of
His son. He doesn't get some sick thrill of watching us suffer. Instead,
He wants us to get a revelation of His Grace that He has freely given us.
I know that "I am free to live my life", as the lyrics to the song goes.
Here's the Grace message in a nutshell. Not only did Jesus die to free us
from our sins and spiritual consequences of our sins, he "has come that we
may have life, and have it to the full" (John 10:10). "For the grace of
God that brings salvation has appeared to all men. It teaches us to say No
to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self- controlled, upright
and godly lives in this present age, while we wait for the blessed hope—
the glorious appearing of our great God and Saviour, Jesus Christ, who gave
himself for us to redeem us from all wickedness and to purify for himself a
people that are his very own, eager to do what is good" (Titus 2:11-14).
So what teaches us to say NO to sin? The Grace of God does. Not the fear
of God's wrath. All punishment, for all sin has been paid for ON THE
"But you know that he appeared so that he might take away our sins. And in
him is no sin" (1John 3:5). "For we know that our old self was crucified
with him so that the body ruled by sin might be done away with,[a] that we
should no longer be slaves to sin- because anyone who has died has been set
free from sin" (Romans 6:6-7). "If then you were raised with Christ, seek
those things which are above, where Christ is, sitting at the right hand of
God. Set your mind on things above, not on things on the earth. For you
died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God. When Christ who is our
life appears, then you also will appear with Him in glory" (Colossians
God not only wants us to be aware of Grace and our freedom "In Him", He
also wants us to "know" Him. The word "know" translates from the Greek
word "sozo". This word means to make one whole and complete - spiritually,
mentally, and physically. It is also translated in other interpretations
as salvation. Jesus' words are thisl; "And this is eternal life, that they
may KNOW You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent" (John
17:3). When God gives us the "free" gift of Salvation, He completes us in
the literal sense of the word. If we are sin focused and constantly afraid
of the wrath of God, how can we truly accept the freedom that He has given
So Diego and whomever this is for, I challenge you to try this. Instead of
sinning then asking for God's forgiveness, praise God for forgiving you
already and for Jesus taking away your past, present, and future sins and
paying the price so that our just God won’t have to punish us. Then…..
take a deep breath. Ahhhh… smell the freedom.
Doug Buckley 25 Apr 2011, 20:35
Hi Ryan, it sounds like you have some good things to say and edify other
Christians with. However, it appears that the crux of your message here is
that we don't have to be concerned about sin. You are certainly saying that
all sins, including sins that haven't been committed yet, are already
forgiven. This implies that as Christians, we just enjoy the ride.
This isn't the case. In fact, Peter warns us about where this doctrine can
lead us to if we are beguiled by it,
"Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling
unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices;
cursed children: Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone
astray...For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure
through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were
clean escaped from them who live in error. While they promise them liberty,
they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is
overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage. For if after they have
escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and
Saviour Jesus Christ, they are AGAIN ENTANGLED THEREIN, AND OVERCOME, the
latter end is worse with them than the beginning. For it had been better
for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have
known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them" (2nd Peter
2.14, 2.18-21 KJV bible).
How could their latter end be worse than their beginning if their future
sins were already forgiven? Peter tells us very clearly that those who
become entangled in sin after having received Christ are worse off, "But it
is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to
his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the
mire" (2nd Peter 2.22 KJV bible). The gospel of Christ is never a liscence
Peter also tells us to be diligent and make our calling and election sure,
not forgetting were we came from, "Wherefore the rather, brethren, give
diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these
things, ye shall never fall. For so an entrance shall be ministered unto
you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus
Christ (1st Peter 1.10-11 KJV bible).
In fact there have been many Christian groups over the years that have
embraced sin, even reveled in it, under the mistaken belief that they can
do whatever want because they are saved in Christ.
Paul tells us to be diligent, resisting evil, "Looking diligently lest any
man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up
trouble you, and thereby many be defiled; Lest there be any fornicator, or
profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright.
For ye know how that afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing,
he was rejected: for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it
carefully with tears" (Hebrews 12.15-17 KJV bible).
This is what Christ warns us about so clearly, "But and if that evil
servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; And shall
begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken;
The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him,
and in an hour that he is not aware of, And shall cut him asunder, and
appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and
gnashing of teeth" (Matthew 24.48-51 KJV bible).
So many churches fail to teach this nowadays because they can't keep the
checks rolling in unless they tell people that they are saved no matter
what they do. They whitewash the situation to make people feel better just
like the false prophets in Ezekiel, "So will I break down the wall that ye
have daubed with untempered morter, and bring it down to the ground, so
that the foundation thereof shall be discovered, and it shall fall, and ye
shall be consumed in the midst thereof: and ye shall know that I am the
LORD" (Ezekiel 13.14 KJV bible).
Lastly, let me say that I am not talking about Diego here, as a pig
wallowing in the mire. In fact it sounds like some people may be laying a
bit of a guilt trip on him. Alot of times the biggest sins are the ones
that seem to go unnoticed, "Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and
swallow a camel" (Matthew 23.24 KJV bible).
But we need to work towards the standard that Christ gives us, "Be ye
therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect"
(Matthew 5.48 KJV bible). We need to fight the good fight to make our
calling and election sure (1st Peter 1.10). God bless
Gilbert 05 Aug 2011, 12:55
Thanks for setting the record straight Buckley. Hebrews 12:14 states
clearly that without holiness NO ONE will see God. We all became christians
so we can go to heaven. If Jesus comes when i am in immorality i will not
go to heaven (1corinthians6:9). All the wicked will go to hell,christian or
not. For my brother Diego who is in masturbation,get out. The grace of God
is enough for us to be set free. I was there and God set me free. I am not
special,He will do it for you.
Tom S 10 Aug 2011, 21:57
Ryan says it well enough. Positionally we are righteous in Christ from the
moment we believe. I refuse to live believing that I can be caught out by
Christ's return at a moment when I have sinned and have not yet repented.
That is to say that I was initially forgiven for the sins I had already
comitted when I believed and then, I should have listed them all out for
forgiveness. Any "new" ones by that thinking would be cause for
condemnation until I confess and repent. You are close to the Roman
Catholic need for absolution at death in case you missed a few sins!
At the time of Christ's death, how many of your sins were still in the
future? All of them. How many were covered/ expiated? all of them.
Otherwise you are going to deny the security of the believer and the
keeping power of Christ.
Gilbert 11 Aug 2011, 03:39
Thanks for your comment Tom. Indeed when we receive Jesus He forgives ALL
our past sins. Infact the Bible says that we become a 'new creation'. But
this new creation now becomes the object of Gods' rebuke and exhortation.
The epistles for instance were written to christian churches. The intention
of these books is to teach christians how to live holy and righteous lives
as we wait for Jesus, NOT in unrighteousness like the pagans do. (1
Thesalonians 4) God says be holy in all you do because he who called you is
holy. He desires a distinction between his own and those who have not known
him. There has to be a difference in our lives when we cross the salvation
line. We're not perfect of course and that is why he says when we stumble
we should rise, repent, learn and strive for a pure life with the help of
the Holy Spirit. The doctrine of future sins being forgiven is a big lie.
Infact the bible rejects deliberate and wilful sinners! (Hebrews 6:4-6,
10:24-30). Lets not misunderstand grace,it is not there as a licence to sin
but as the power to enable beleivers overcome sin. I have read Christ
teaching that some preachers and miracle doers will be shut out of heaven
because they were evildoers. To my understanding preachers can only be
christians but they did not live clean lives. Use the blood of Jesus to
clean your heart and refine your salvation. Christians are called to mature
(Ephesians 4) in their walk with God and He who promised is able to
accomplish that purification. Be ye holy 1peter 2:14-16
Gilbert 11 Aug 2011, 04:23
The correct scripture reference to Gods' call for holiness as posted above
is 1Peter 1:14-16 not 1peter 2:14-16. Apologies for the error. Other
scriptures relevant to my comments include Leviticus 11:44-45, 2corintians
5:17 and Matthew 25:1-13. Blessings. Gilbert.
Tom S 11 Aug 2011, 07:39
I'd been taught that the verse about the blood of Jesus Christ cleanses us
from all sin was a continuing tense--keeps on cleansing us.
Doug Buckley 12 Aug 2011, 17:39
Hi all, let me just say that I don't believe in a roller coaster ride of
salvation (sin, repent, sin, repent). In fact Paul says that after a
certain point its impossible to renew someone who has fallen away (Hebrews
6.6). In Christ our sins are covered every day, but Christianiy is a
journey and we can back slide and fall off the path. This is why when
Christ returns many will be cast into the outer darkness (Matthew 25.30).
The obvious question is at what point do our sins cause us to lose
salvation? Paul gives us some idea, "For if we sin wilfully after that we
have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice
for sins" (Hebrews 10.26 KJV bible). Ultimately it's between us and God,
because he knows our hearts. I discussed this at length with John (see the
article faith vs. works).
robert oakley 24 Aug 2011, 09:10
Hi, I have read this statements. legimnate and sincere and very important
to the discussion in todays world. I would like to say a word or two. There
is more to Sin than what has been expressed here and until the real
identity of our enemy is revealed we will have this back and forth
discussion on the position of Sin in life and how to deal with it.
Col 2:15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of
them openly, triumphing over them in it.So here is Sin.
Then we have Pride of Life, lust of the flesh, lust of the eyes to contend
with, which is our carnal mind and natural ways. Two enemys of God being
understood here in what I am saying and we have to learn to let the Spirit
of Christ move in us being willing to obey his word and truth to wash us
from sin and choose in Reverance to resist evil.
To fear God is to hate evil.
I could spend alot of time trying to explain more about my words here but
it would take a while to do so. There is a big difference of Living in Sin
and carry Sin. In Christ we have power of powers, principaltiies(sins) and
if we believe in Christ is has paid for them and will deliver us present
and future sins but we have to be willing to humble ourselves and confess
and begin to allow Chrsit to re-new our carnal mind into the mind of Christ
to be able to resist the temptor in his attemp to cause all of us to fail
the grace of God. If you believe Chrsit is the Son of God and that God
raised him from the dead; giving your life over to him to do his good
pleasure in your life, repented and confessed a sinners life asking him to
forgive you and begin a work in you with a pure heart from which God called
you; revealed his Son to and accepted Him.
Then those past sins are forgiven but the future is up to us and not
already planned, though God knows the path he has for you, we as human free
willed beings are giving a choice to either have Christ fulling formed in
us with his mind living holy and righteous, being full of light.
Or living in darkness with no life, no hope or love, full of oppression
living out the devils plan in our life. God will not make you choose him
and will not seperate you from your friends.
Hope this helps anyone. God bless.
If Diego really has that problem, I would tell you to find a deliverance
ministry you can trust and have him deal with the perversion and sexual
defilement you have been letting in your self and find postive paths to
health outlets to help change your mind, its not so much the act of
masterbation thats wrong its whats on your mind and are you fornicating
with people in your mind. Its a natural function but if you are compulsive
then it is a power of darkness causing you to commit the act which is why I
mentioned deliverance which will deal with the spiritual aspect. God Bless
dennis 27 Sep 2011, 03:15
DIEGO, IT WAS IF YOU WERE DESCRIBING ME, WITH THE PROBLEM OF
MASTURBATION, I TOO HAVE THIS VERY VERY BURDEN, AS I FEEL SHAME
AND HATE MYSELF , AFTER KNOWINGLY COMMITTING THE ACT, I VE
CONFESSED EACH WEEK TO MY PASTOR, AND FEEL EVEN MORE GUILT, AS I
FEEL I HAVE NO CONTROL OVER THIS, IT CONTROLS ME, SATAN KNOW
THIS OF COURSE, SO THAT IS WHERE IAM LOST, I BEG GOD TO REMOVE
THESE TERRIBLE ACTIONS, AND IAM AFRAID THAT I WILL BE UNABLE TO
"LIVE" MY LIFE, WITHOUT THIS RELEASE, GOD HELP ME. , DENNIS.
rebecca 03 Oct 2011, 12:25
This is very interesting. I was always taught to ask for forgiveness right
away. But my friend disagrees with this as she is a preacher of free
grace... and when Christ died on the cross for our sins....this means all
our sin...past present and future. And I defiantly see the good in
accepting that and not living in fear....it IS almost disrespectful to not
acknowledge the fact that indeed we are forgiven. On the same note, as
someone mentioned above...It is wise to know what your triggers are when it
comes to past addictions,stumbling blocks to your old life, ect ... And
when those things come us... we should turn away (or repent) To repent is a
choice, choosing not to do something....So, I don't think that it's too far
off to say that we SHOULD repent from some old ways of living....If we make
a mistake we should recognize it and pray that we have the strength to turn
away next time, and know that we are forgiven....God was once human
(although perfect) but recognizes and understands our fallen nature.....We
are forgiven!....but being conscience of our stumbling blocks and repenting
and turning away from that is WISE!
Doug Buckley 04 Oct 2011, 14:06
Rebecca, I basically agree with what you're saying. Repenting isn't really
avoiding sin, but recognizing it and regreting it after the fact.
Let's say we are like countries. When we are saved Christ takes control of
the government in us. Sin is ALWAYS invading and working to overthrow the
government of Christ in us. Repenting, and avoiding pitfalls and stumbling
blocks makes his government more dominant in us. However its not as though
if we sinned or were at a low point or forgot to repent about something we
are not saved. As long as sin doesn't overthrow Christ and take back
control of our lives we are saved.
jeremy kinuthia 27 Oct 2011, 15:23
every thing is done in faith so by faith we are forgiven by faith we
receive our blesssing and never by works if you thing whatever you do is a
sin /not a sin then it means you want to please God by your works christ
saved us to restore us to the initial status god created us in he dont want
us to partake from the tree of knowledge of good and evil coz that
knowledge led to falling of mankind and made man worship God nit from his
heart but just to be acepted before god so as a christian christ calls you
to be led by the spirit of God through which you will never sertisfy the
desires of the flesh if you are lid by the spirit be sure you will live a
sinless life hence no repentance but if you want to exersice your'free
will' you will bump in to sin not so long so just be led by the spirit do
not be sin concious partake from tree of life and seek God first.REMEMBER
HE CREATED YOU TO WORSHIP HIM NOT TO LOoK AFTER YOUR OWN LIFE. HE IS ABLE
TO LEAD YOU IN PATHS OF RIGHTEOUSNESS. after abraham believed God it was
counted to hism as righteousness let us emmulate his life for we are his
descendants do you see him repent after he lied about his wife. there are
many examples but if you ask God he will teach you make him alone your
teacher. be blessed
AdoptedJew 30 Oct 2011, 02:06
Matthew 5:8 Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.
What does the bible say about our heart?
9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can
10 I the LORD search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man
according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings.
So, we know we can't even trust ourselves. We can only depend on God and
the bible to guide us and show us where we're wrong in our lives.
1 Corinthians 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot
inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth *corruption inherit incorruption*.
When you give your life to Christ, that doesn't mean you stop sinning. This
is why we strive for righteousness, drawing closer and closer to God and
shedding our will in the process, sacrificing ourselves to do the Father's
will. Sin cannot inherit the kingdom of God. Paul preaches constantly that
it is possible for one of our "brothers" to be sinning still (1 Corinthians
5:9-13, 1 Corinthians 6:9-10)
1 John 3:2-3
2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we
shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for
we shall see him as he is.
3 And every man that hath this hope in him *purifieth himself*, even as he
To purify is a process of cleansing yourself from all unrighteousness.
Right after that, John says...
1 John 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is
the transgression of the law.
It is still very much possible to sin after being saved, and if you do,
you've transgressed the law. However, under the covenant of grace, we can
ask for forgiveness and guidance to strive for Holiness.
1 John 3:5-10
5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is
6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen
him, neither known him.
7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is
righteous, even as he is righteous.
8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the
beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might
destroy the works of the devil.
9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in
him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the
devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that
loveth not his brother.
Sin CANNOT inherit the kingdom of God. This doctrine of "living in sin
until we die or Christ returns" will send you straight to hell...we need to
purify our hearts in THIS lifetime, otherwise, we will not inherit the
kingdom of God. Ask God to show you what's in your heart that isn't of Him
and HE WILL! He wants us all to inherit the kingdom but it's up to us on
whether we decide to live in righteousness or not. IF Christ was to
"perfect" us when He returns, then this scripture would be void.
11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let
him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still:
and he that is holy, let him be holy still.
12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every
man according as his work shall be.
13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the
14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to
the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers,
and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.
Just like Jesus did it in the flesh, so can we (THROUGH CHRIST). If you say
it isn't possible, you call Christ a liar and our salvation is all a lie
and you're wasting your time.
Live holy, live in righteousness! We inherited the kingdom of God through
the unbelief of the Jews! Time is running short, and more and more of
Abraham's true seed is accepting Christ. We've been adopted through their
unbelief, but it will not last forever. Christ is soon to return and we do
not have time to be fiddling our thumbs. God bless you all
-I already know there are three responses to what I've said. Those who will
disagree and be upset, or those who will agree, or those who disagree but
will pray on it and research and look it up to see if it's true. Please, do
not be one of those who are lukewarm and is comfortable living in sin.-
haena 17 Nov 2011, 03:34
hi! This conversation made me jump! haha.. This is all about Sin and
Forgiveness,, yeah. Praise You Lord. When Jesus died on the cross, we are
not existing yet, that was 2000 years ago, and so, our sins are being not
committed yet, that proves that ALL sins have been forgiven even before
they were comitted. We, Believers confess our sins NOT for us to be
forgiven, BUT BECAUSE WE ARE FORGIVEN.
haena 17 Nov 2011, 05:25
wait I'm not done yet .. hehe.. well, we ARE ALREADY FORGIVEN for all of
our sins. We confess not for us to be forgiven again and again, we confess
for us to have the realization of HOW DEEP the Forgiveness of OUR God is.
God is the ALL-Knowing GOd, even before Jesus was born, He already knew
that you will commit such sins TODAY, TOMORROW, and so on, but STILL He
chose to sacrifice His ONE AND ONLY SON JESUS just for someone like you.
Did you ever realised that TRUTH? John 3:16 -- "For God so loved the world
that he gave His One and Only Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not
perish but have eternal life." -- If you could just realised, God gave
Jesus as our Salvation NOT because we need to be saved, BUT simply
because HE SO LOVED US. He wants us to be saved. His Love is extreme. For
he Himself is Love. While committing such sins, just imagine how God has
forgiven you. When you stumble, don't fall away from Grace, but fall into
His Grace. Jesus is our Righteousness, we are not righteous by ourselves,
we can never be. Jesus is our Hollines -- "And by that will, we have been
made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once for all."
Self-condemanation leads us away from God, and that condemation is the
fruit of our sins.
John 16:8-11 "When He comes (the Holy Spirit), He will convict the world of
guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment: in regard to sin
because men do not believe in Me; in regard to righteousness because I AM
going to the Father, where you can see me no longer; and in regard to
judgment, because the prince of this world stands condenmed."
--The HS will expose the guilt of the world because men do not believe in
Him, are you still belong to this world? God's only requirement is to
BELIEVE IN HIS SON (read 1John3:21) Yes we will still sin as long as we
live, but more than feeling the guilt, we should give more emphasis on the
depth of His Mercy, Love and Forgiveness, that is if you are TRULY
believing Him, because if not, guilt will swallow you wholly. The sin will
either guilt you to-death, or will cause you to stand in awe -- feeling the
Father's intimate and unconditional love. And if you are a true believer,
here's for you -- 'in regard to righteousness because I am going to the
Father....' -- If you are a TRUE believer, then the HS will CONVICT YOU of
Your Righteousness which is Jesus that is sitting at the right hand of the
Father, He is our Representative in Heaven, that because we Believe in His
Son wholeheartedly, our Father will always be reminded of His punishment to
us through His Own Son. So how could He condemned you whenever you sin? If
the HS is the one who makes you feel guilty whenever you sin, then what's
the use of crusifiction? Instead of reminding how heavy your sins are, He
will rather remind you of HOW GREAT your Salvation is! of How loving your
God is! Of how depth His Grace is! And so instead of falling away from
Grace because of your sin, He will make you fall inlove more into His Grace
with great awe.
Romans 5:20 " But where sin is increased, grace increased all the more..."
-- Sin may bring you to the depth of God's grace, but Grace will never
bring you to sin. It is the grace that will say NO to ungodliness, not your
guiltness. I've been to a situation before that whenever i sin, I repented
immediately (almost evry moment). Unitl God made me understood His PURE
GRACE -- no effort from me. the Bible is true, Grace will teach us to say
NO to sin in a way that our attention will be on His Greatness ALONE, on
His Grace, on His power, on His Majesty, on His Love, all in all our focus
will be on Eternal things ALONE. Wherein temptations are not so tempting
anymore, where our bitterness are soaking in His sweetness, where fears are
hiding in His Presence, wherein SEEKING Him is the only thing i've ever
wanted.. Not even noticing that while seeking the King, His Kingdom follows
me. I almost forgotten the things about sinning, and realized that my sins
can't enter to His Presence. Amazing God.
Instead of seeking the commandments, His Grace taught me to seek the
Commander; instead of seeking His Promises, His Grace taught me to seek the
Promise-Giver; instead of seeking for the blessings, His Grace taught me to
seek the Blesser.
I still sin ofcourse (lighter but still have same punishment ), but
according to the Bible, NOTHING CAN sepearate me from my God. (Rom8:38-39).
2Corinthians 5:17 -- "Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new
creation; the old has gone, the new has come! All this is from God, who
reconciled us to Himself through Christ and gave us the ministry of
reconciliation: that God was reconciling the world to Himself in Christ,
NOT COUNTING MEN'S SINS AGAINST THEM. And He has committed to US the
MESSAGE of reconcillation." -- Just think about it, I believe that Jesus
will reveal to you the Depthness of Himself.
There is only One way to avoid sin, and that is JESUS. If you are still
'enjoying' in doing some sins, BELIEVE in the NAME of your Savior. You are
indeed in the working progress of your growth in Him. when you do sin,
realised how He's convicting you that you are righteous-- in Him, you will
cry in awe, that even though you're still sinning God still sees you
righteous. Then that will be the greatest feeling you could ever have,
being in His very Presence. Sinking in His Grace. He understands our
nature, and He already made a way. Then gooluck to yor sins (great sins) if
they could still tempt you.
One more question: Do you wash yourself before taking a bath?
He is our purifying water. Feel free to soak youself.
Let us love ourselves the way God is loving us, and we will learn to love
others the way He loves them.
More Grace be upon us. I would love to read your response. ^_^
Doug Buckley 17 Nov 2011, 12:33
Hi Haena, yes, Jesus died for our sins two thousand years ago, and yes
whoever believes in him will have eternal life (John 3.16), and is free
from their sins. Jesus loves us, and his love is extreme to forgive us of
our sins. We all agree with that, but none of that is biblical evidence
that a person cannot turn away from Jesus and lose salvation.
Ultimately, what is the final authority, Jesus or a church? He is the
Living Word and the bible is his book. The bible is unequivocal on this
"For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the
knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are AGAIN ENTANGLED
THEREIN, AND OVERCOME, the latter end is worse with them than the
beginning. For it had been better for them not to have known the way of
righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy
commandment delivered unto them. But it is happened unto them according to
the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow
that was washed to her wallowing in the mire" (2nd Peter 2.20-22 KJV
"But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his
coming; And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink
with the drunken; The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he
looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, And shall cut
him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall
be weeping and gnashing of teeth" (Matthew 24.48-51 KJV bible).
Jesus will not be mocked and if a believer chooses this sinful world over
him they will not be saved from the consequences of their sins.
You quote Hebrews 10.10, but when the verse is looked at in context (which
is critical) its actually not saying what you think it is. Its really
saying that Jesus sacrificed himself ONCE on the cross, because his
offering was perfect, unlike the continual animal sacrifices of the first
Paul goes on to tell us, "For if we sin wilfully after that we have
received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth NO MORE SACRIFICE for
sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation,
which shall devour the adversaries" (Hebrews 10.26-27 KJV bible).
You quote Romans 8 that nothing can separate us from the love of God in
Christ, but again look at the context. Paul mentions "things" like powers
and principalities. He's not saying we can't choose the world over Christ.
"For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to
one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ. But I
fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty,
so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ"
(2nd Corinthians 11.2-3 KJV bible).
So there you have it. I'm not trying to scare anyone, but the reality is
that believers have to take heed and keep their lamps lit like the ten
virgins. Nothing can pull a believer away except for their own poor
choices, and willingness to be deceived by some doctrine other than what
Christ teaches in his Word.
Tom 15 Dec 2011, 14:03
I think I have Scrupulosity, and OCD. This affects my christian faith, and
I believe every day I sin. For thoughts that are blasphemous.
But this gets me absolutely paranoid, that if I can't what exact thought i
had that was wrong I can't repent every day when I get these thoughts.
I might lie by accident like saying, Feliz Navidad was french - i thought
it was and it wasn't. So then I lied and sinned again! Then i said 'no one
cares about you' to myself and got paranoid thinking i said it to the holy
I can't repent every day can I? I'm worried about turning forgiveness into
something cheap and meanless, but i still need forgiveness daily. Or do
I'm worried i'm requiring Prayer for entry into heaven and insultnig God.
Have I not already got forgiveness for future sins? can't i just thank god
every day with the Lords Prayer? Which even mentioned forgive us our
haena 15 Dec 2011, 20:57
Hi Tom =) Please read my previous post. I'll try to leave more comment
May Jesus speak to your very heart. =)
Doug Buckley 16 Dec 2011, 01:14
Hi Tom, I struggle with some of those issues myself.
We all sin every day, and it takes a true Christian to recognize that. Yes
you should recognize and repent for your sins, and thank Jesus for
forgiveness. However, God does not keep a laundry list of your sins that
you need to repent for. It's not like if you forget to repent of one sin
you're no longer a Christian. If a Christian sins the minute before they
die they are still forgiven. If you are in Christ all the sins you commit
However, your future sins are NOT forgiven. Jesus continually heals us of
our sins IF we have faith in him. The bible is clear that Christians can
and do fall away. If we choose the world over Jesus, and let our light of
faith die out, our sins aren't forgiven.
"And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are
gone out" (Matthew 25.8 KJV bible).
GP 23 Dec 2011, 15:08
As I read These passages, I hear one saying all sins are forgiven, past
present and future. I also hear this same one saying that increasing
knowlege of the Word initiates a responce of not wanting to sin anymore,
although we all do. On the other hand I hear one who says that to sin
willingly after being forgiven, there is no more sacrifice for sin,
although we all do. What I hear both saying is that we all sin, and we all
know better and don't want to. You all are in accord. Christ said when two
or more are in agreement with asking anything, I will do it for them. Pray
that we all can stop sin within ourselves to the Great Father through
Christ. I also hear both sides saying we must acknowlege our sins, one side
says they revelle in the fact they are already forgiven and one says you
have to ask to be forgiven. The fact remains that we do have to acknowlege
them and from what The word has taught me, you have to ask forgiveness with
a pure heart. The one says as you get closer to GOD you do not want to sin,
which is true, and you are already forgiven if you acknowlege it and that
means confessing it and asking for pardon. Almighty God knows beginning to
end, Telling God you have sinned is the way of letting God know that you
know that God knows. Christ died once for all. I have struggled with what
Paul said,If you sin willingly after knowing the truth, there is no more
sacrifice for sin,and quite frankly it scares the hell out of me. I don't
know about anyone else but to me this is the fear of the Lord. I strive for
perfection but am always found wanting in the eyes of Him who is perfection
in essence. I ask for strength and knowlege but sin every day, well almost
every day, but then I ask for strength and knowledge not to do it anymore
and also forgivness. I don't know everything, who does but one? But I think
I know the chance for freedom is given as a gift, the choice of freedom is
earned. We have to make a strong effort and we get better and better at it.
Grace is a gift for sure, but we have to take it from there. May the Lord
give us all wisdom
tee 12 Jan 2012, 06:09
I have been saved for about a year and a half. And I fornicate at times. I
know its wrong and I ask for forgiveness but I also feel so ashamed after
because I don't like disappointing god. Sometimes I can sustain myself, and
I can be really on track and then I fall. I read the bible a lot, fast, and
pray. I thought I had a problem until a prophet said my problem was
yielding. I have changed a lot of my bad habits, but this one seems the
hardest. People say I'm too hard on myself, but I just want to stop this
act of sin and serve the lord wholeheartedly.
Daniel 12 Jan 2012, 10:56
I read your scriptures from above.
I really disagreed for some of the interpretation.
Being in this modern world we are doing sin every movement. Bible says that
by our thought also we will commit sin. Human beings are not a perfect
In our daily bases we have to repent on Him(Jesus).
It's so important to us.
Doug Buckley 12 Jan 2012, 22:02
Hi Tee, Romans 6 talks about how we should yield our bodies to God instead
of yielding to unrighteousness and sin, so repent and keep trying. For alot
of Christians the root of their habitual sinning is a lack of faith,
because they're not getting fed in churches.
ctincher 19 Jan 2012, 09:58
hebrews 10:26 is talking about hearing thr gospel of christ and rejecting
it. if you say you are saved and continue to live your life like you did
before did u truly repent? born again christians sin daily a thought can
come into your mind you may say things out of anger. you can sin in your
sleep. seek God daily and repent daily even hourly. not one of us is
Evangelist 27 Jan 2012, 15:53
As children of God, we have to turn away from sin, Quit, give up, Repent,
seek the Lord for what ever it is that have power over you. no weapon
formed against you shall prosper. Is. 54:17 the battle is not yours, it
belongs to God. seek his face, He will deliver you. fast, and pray, VICTORY
is yours. remember, 1 john 4;4 Ye are of God, little children, and have
overcome them; because greater is He that is within me than he that is in
the world. confess Gods word to that spirit, I belong to God, I am a new
creature in Christ, I am a child of the King. and I rebuke you, you have no
power over me, and with God all things are possible to them that believe.
I pray this will help someone to hold on to God, Pray as never before.
Sarah 20 Feb 2012, 10:51
Sometimes we find ways to justify sin. We have to see sin as it is and if
we don't then we will find ourselves standing before the Lord on judgement
day and he is going to say, department from me you workers of iniquity, I
never knew you. Masterbation is no different than any other sin, it is
nothing more than self gratification. The bible says in 2nd Corinthians
5:17 KJV "Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old
things are passed away; behold, all things are become new." We need to
change our way of thinking he tells us in Philippians 4:8 KJV "Finally,
brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest,
whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things
are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue,
and if there be any praise, think on these things." Jesus hates sin and so
should we. If we want to be like Jesus and live with Jesus forever then we
should make going to heaven our ultimate goal and don't let anything or
anyone hinder us from going there.
TJ 17 Apr 2012, 00:04
I want you to know you are not the only one struggling with OCD and
scrupulosity. I also struggle with it. What you must realize is that those
thoughts are not your own. A normal person gets a blasphemous thought in
their brain and think "What? That's not what I meant" and shrug it off. But
our brains are chemically imbalanced. So when we get a thought, we obssess
over it, and perform ritual prayers to cleanse us of our sin. This usually
leads to fear of rethinking those thoughts, which leads to actually having
those thoughts. What you need to do is, and it's not easy, but when you get
those thoughts, you remind yourself that they are not yours. YOU don't
want them, and it's not YOU willfully thinking them. They come into your
brain and intrude against your will. There's a difference between willfully
sinning and suffering with scrupulosity, where Satan throws thoughts into
our heads. I really sinned earlier, not scrupulosity, which is what led me
to do a search that led to this page. God is using this for our good,
though I was wrong. I've accepted His forgiveness, and asked Him to reveal
any unforgiveness or sin in my life, and I trust He will do it. BUT he
won't do it by condemning me. (John 3:17) He will give me the sound
knowledge, not "Oh no, did I sin here, or have I not forgiven them?!?" He
will gently, but definitively instruct me, as He is my God and my Father.
So, in short, resist those thoughts by not letting them cause you to
perform those ritual prayers, but trust that if you actually sin, God will
reveal it to you in peace, and not in the constant torment that
Scrupulosity provides. That is not from God. Your thoughts are not from
you. I hope this helps. Also, you may want to see a psychiatrist to help
you with some cognitive behavioral therapy (I recommend a Christian
Psychiatrist, strongly) and he/she will probably prescribe you medication
that can really help, too.
God bless you, we share this struggle, but know that one day we will stand
side by side looking upon God's Glory.
Doug Buckley 17 Apr 2012, 10:39
Hi TJ, that's good advice. I deal with some OCD type issues. My mind tends
to dwell on and repeat things. Different people think differently, and God
understands because he makes us that way. We all sin, but my thoughts are
much better when I occupy my mind with scriptures.
Michael 24 Apr 2012, 10:01
Hello fellow brothers and sisters in Christ....i have read all these posts
about salvation and i just wanna say that if we have to maintain our
salvation by good works of righteousness then Christ died in vain and its a
sad day for a babe in Christ to read these posts and at the end of it all
they are left confused, sad, and unworthy....the bible is God-breathed, but
also it says to rightly divide the word line upon line and precept upon
precept!!! And if anybody wants to know what the will of the Father is
.......read John 6:40, and that plainly says: "And this is the will of Him
who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son, and believes in Him may have
everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day." Jesus
followers asked Him, "what shall we do , that we may work the works of God?
Jesus replied "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He
sent!" ....then Romans 4:1-8...........its all on our faith in Jesus that
brings us and keeps us in right standing with God, thats why we can be
confident of our eternity because He did it all and we cant add nothing to
the cross!!! Peter, Paul, John,James,Mary, or whoever did not get nailed to
the cross but one man, JESUS, and its in Him we live,move and have our very
being! Glory to God! There is no boasting in our works...as a matter of
fact our rigtheousness is as filthy rags anyway....He wants us to be
perfect and holy as He is because that would shoot down anyone who thinks
he has arrived as a Christian!! We have to separate Spirit from flesh
also.....How are we born again according to Jesus in the book of John?? By
Spirit!!! Thats how we are perfect in Christ, because that same Spirit
seals us (ephesians 1:13) when we accept and believe on Jesus!!! Now the
flesh is dealt with when we read Romans 12:1-2, we present our "bodies" a
living sacrifice holy and acceptable to God because it is our reasonable
service.....then it goes on to saying about "dont be conformed to the world
but be ye transformed by the renewing of our "minds".........Now notice how
it talks about our bodies and minds(FLESH) here and Jesus is saying being
born again by Spirit(SPIRIT) in John 3.....we have to get an understanding
of who we are in Christ and how God seees us hidden in His Son!! I read
someof you kept quoting Hebrews 6:4-6 and about sinning willfully after
receiving the truth.....dont you know that the first 11 chapters of Hebrews
is tallking about doing away with the old covenant way of sacrifices and
religious acts and turning to the excellent way and only way Jesus and the
cross?? To not turn from their old testament ideas is willfull sin and
there remains no more sacrifice for sin because they are putting the
sacrifice Jesus made on the cross to an open shame!!! And therefore there
remains no way for them to come to repentance( summarizing the
quotes).....i can go on but to those out there who are struggling in a
certain area in your life, dont faint and lose hope because just like Paul
in Romans 7 struggled with sin, you can too but the only way to come out is
to keep your eyes fixed on Jesus and what He did on the cross....Paul never
stated how long it took for him to overcome but eventually he did, not by
God scaring him to throw him in hell either, but by his hope in the One who
overcame the world and the lusts thereof for him........Be blessed and much
love to everyone
Hank Knegt 24 Apr 2012, 14:57
To whom it may concern;
To continue sinning after learning the truth about it is a very risky
We should not wilfully sin expecting that every sin past present and future
is forgivable. Heb 10:26 says, for one doing that, there is no sacrifice
left for sin.
It makes one an adversary of God, and such ones can only look forward to
This is a hard pill for most to swallow, as they prefer to hold on to a
life of knowingly sinning, and being sold down the river by teaching of
being forgiven for all sins past present and future. If continuing to
wilfully sin ends in destruction, the sins that are forgiven are those done
with out knowing they were wrong, and turning away from them when one finds
out they are wrong.
Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge
of the truth, there remaineth no more a sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and a fierceness
of fire which shall devour the adversaries.
Heb 10:28 A man that hath set at nought Moses law dieth without compassion
on the word of two or three witnesses:
Heb 10:29 of how much sorer punishment, think ye, shall he be judged
worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the
blood of the covenant wherewith he was sanctified an unholy thing, and hath
done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
Also Rom 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace
Rom 6:2 God forbid. We who died to sin, how shall we any longer live
Repent does not mean only to feel sorry, but to turn away from and stop
doing what we know is wrong.
A friend would tell you this. The enemy says "Keep on sinning knowing it
is wrong and grace will save you."
A friend Hank Knegt
kevin sadler 27 Apr 2012, 12:23
Hi anyone following this blog,
I came across this blog whilst preparing a message about repentance and
At the early stages of prep I often look around at what people are saying
and commenting on related topics. I have to say that what I believe God has
revealed to me is that Repentance is the most amazing gift/tool that God
has given us, individual and tailored to our circumstances. It is the
incredible miracle that releases us from the bondage that Sin (unforgiven)
can bring us into. This includes the preoccupation of those things that
bring us down. Repentance is so often seen as a negative thing (because we
have sinned and need to repent) Repentance to a true believer leads to
liberty, freedom, joy and all other manifestations of the indwelling
Christ. Why spend so much time in the murky mire when you have repented ?
Humans seem to need to pay the price one way or another even when we say we
believe in Christs provision. I have not quoted scripture for my
reflections I dont think I need to they have all been quoted already.
Sipho 01 Jun 2012, 23:28
Guys i just wanna say thanks for posting on this page, for now i discovered
things that i didn't know. Me eIther i have a problem masturbation but when
i read this page, i felt transformation in my life and may God bless you
guys as from now henceforth i will never be the same again in the name of
Ernest 12 Jun 2012, 20:11
Am I an Apostate unable to repent?
34 years ago I was a Born Again believer. I loved Christ and received the
Holy Spirit. Over the years I ran into problems and ended up backsliding
which led to me returning to a sinful lifestyle with drunkenness and
womanizing, etc, for many years without repentance. I don't know how I got
so bad, but I did. I regret all of this and how this has ruined my life and
my faith. I lost my righteousness and fear that I have lost the Lord
forever. I miss the guidance of the Spirit. I believe that I'm an Apostate
beyond redemption. Is there any hope for me to be restored? Honest answers
1 year ago Report Abuse
Doug Buckley 14 Jun 2012, 03:33
Hi Ernest. I can't say whether or not you're an apostate or even if you
were saved in the first place. I can say that Paul says that after a
believer reaches a level of spiritual maturity, if they "fall away", they
cannot be renewed (Hebrews 6.5-6.6). So there is a point of no return, but
its hard to say what that point is and if any particular Christian has gone
That being said, a person who turns to sin and falls away does this because
they lack faith. So if they lack faith then deep down inside they don't
care or believe that they are falling away from anything. Maybe they are
superstitious, and afraid of what men have told them about going to hell.
But in this age, its impossible for a nonbeliever to truly believe and
understand they are unsaved.
So if you miss the Lord then seek him, and repent for your sins, and renew
your relationship with him.
PWC 20 Jun 2012, 21:12
"For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the
truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins"
Paul says that after a believer reaches a level of spiritual maturity, if
they "fall away", they cannot be renewed.
Those 2 scare me the most. I have been a sinner with sexual lewd thoughts,
videos, pictures, etc...that I am extremely ashamed of for the past 25
years. I was baptized a few years back, and still fell back into the same
trap. At some point 2 years ago, evil voices and thoughts came into my head
constantly about God and Jesus, I could do nothing to get them out, it made
me think God has left me. After much prayer, advice, and medicine, the
thoughts stopped a few months later. I stopped the sexual garbage during
that and have tried my best to keep stopping that kind of behavior. A few
weeks ago I just started to feel really ashamed of my past sins, and I have
repented a lot, now I feel I repented too much or the devil is making me
feel past the point of repentance. I am truly sorry in my heart for sinning
so long and consider that another body that was doing that vulgar stuff,
and this is my new body that is forgiven. I thanked God for forgiving me
and sorry for repenting over and over. Thoughts, help, and prayers would be
hank 21 Jun 2012, 08:27
Being baptized does not equal spiritual maturity.
In fact it is a mere beginning not an end.
Coming to maturity is not in our control.
We should strive to go there, and can, if God permits it.
If in our heart we think we are doing wrong, then one can be sure it is
We have no better friend than the Lord. He paid a sin debt for us that is
so great, we could only pay for it ourselves with death eternal.
As such we ought to do what He desires of us, not because we have to but
because we want to. Thus is his will done on earth by us as His will is
done in heaven.
These statement can all be found in scriptures if you care to find them.
Take heart. If you think being baptized is becoming mature, then you are
not in possession of mature knowledge. We should not continue sinning
knowing it is sin.
How long does one keep a friend here, if one continually offends him or
What sin is worth hanging on to, if there is the slightest chance of losing
eternal life over it?
If one strives hard to avoid evil, God will help,with a way out.
"Resist the devil and he will flee from you." Not even Satan has power to
make one sin, but we have obligation to resist.
Think of the Lord as your absolute bestest friend, and love Him in return
by doing what He wants, which are only things that are good for you.
Comments on being able to lose the Holy Spirit and not being able to
receive it a second time above are true.
Doug Buckley 21 Jun 2012, 12:35
Hi PWC, hank makes some good points. It sounds like you're on the right
track, but also a bit paranoid or overly focused on this. Your focus
shouldn't be on doing this or that to be saved, but on God. He is our guide
and knows if we love him or not, and leads us into repentance, and gets us
into shape. It sounds like there are people around you who are pressuring
you and worrying you about "being saved". God is more in control than they
Paul's statement is more a warning to mature believers about being
fruitless or becoming stagnant. We can become spiritually "dead",
especially when we don't put Christ first. When we don't discover or grow
spiritually things become old and trite and we start to lose our faith and
give in more to sin. He compares this to being fruitless ground. Studying
the Word is very important.
Hank 23 Jun 2012, 11:37
Many do not realize how much salvation is in the hands of God and not
Neither do many realize that being saved is just the beginning.
Repenting, is turning our selves from living in the worldly ways to truly
seeking the Lord.
It is repentance that leads to remission of sins through the free gift of
life which is in Jesus.
If repentance was not part of it then why would John have been sent to
Turning to God (repentance)does not earn us everlasting life, but we cannot
get to it without turning to God.
Mar 1:2 Even as it is written in Isaiah the prophet, Behold, I send my
messenger before thy face, Who shall prepare thy way.
Mar 1:3 The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Make ye ready the way
of the Lord, Make his paths straight;
Mar 1:4 John came, who baptized in the wilderness and preached the baptism
of repentance unto remission of sins.
How do we get saved ?
Most preachers on TV say that you have to pray the prayer of salvation.
After they have prayed this prayer it is announced that they are saved.
It is not in our hands to get saved through either repentance or a prayer.
It is God who brings us to repentance in the first place. It is the Father
that draws us to Jesus.
No one comes to Jesus if the Father does not draw him.
The Lord knows who has a true repenting heart and who does not.
John called some Pharisses who came to him a brood of vipers, knowing they
were not there for the right reason, and had not been
drawn by God to repent, thus he asked then who had told them to come. John
would not have called them vipres had they been earnestly repenting.
NO ONE CAN COME TO THE FATHER EXCEPT THROUGH JESUS
Joh 14:6 Jesus said to him, I am the true and living way: no one comes to
the Father but by me.
Joh 14:7 If you had knowledge of me, you would have knowledge of my
Father: you have knowledge of him now and have seen him.
NO ONE CAN COME TO JESUS EXCEPT THE FATHER DRAW HIM.
Joh 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father that sent me draw him:
and I will raise him up in the last day.
Joh 6:45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall all be taught of
God. Every one that hath heard from the Father, and hath learned, cometh
This is all too wonderful. Salvation depends on no man, and is available
to all men.
God himself initiates and completes it. Amen.
Hank 25 Jun 2012, 11:24
Has God forgiven us all past present and future sins?
Does what we do have an impact on staying in God's grace ?
Many say, and some on this site that all sins past present and future are
This is not stated in the scriptures for a good reason, namely that it is
not necessarily so.
Satan has taught from the beginning that sinning is ok, and the above view
is just an example of it, namely that God's grace will cover anything we
have done, do, and will do.
Three examples that warn against this view.
1. Shall we continue to sin so that grace may abound? Answer is no.
Rom 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace
Rom 6:2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer
Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ
were baptized into his death?
Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like
as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so
we also should walk in newness of life.
2. If we do not forgive others their trespasses against us, God will not
forgive us our trespasses. If our trespasses are not forgiven by God, then
we have to pay the penalty for sinning ourselves. That penalty is death.
See the parable of the servant who was forgiven a huge debt he could not
repay, and was forgiven it. Then he would not forgive another person a
small debt. When the master found out, his original debt was again charged
to him again and he had to pay it in full with death.
Mat 18:33 Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy
fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee?
Mat 18:34 And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors,
till he should pay all that was due unto him. (FULL DEBT)
Mat 18:35 So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye
from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses.
NOT FORGIVING A BROTHER RESULTS IN NOT BEING FORGIVEN YOUR SELF BY GOD, IN
WHICH CASE YOU HAVE OT PAY THE PENALTY OF SIN YOURSELF.
There are sins that are not forgivable ever, not in the past, not in the
present and not in the future..
Any one committing one of these is not forgiven.
Mat 12:31 Therefore I say unto you, Every sin and blasphemy shall be
forgiven unto men; but the blasphemy against the Spirit shall not be
HERE IS A SIN CLEARLY STATED AS NOT BEING COVERED BY GRACE. iF IT IS NOT
FORGIVEN, THEN THE PENALTY HAS TO BE PAID BY ONESELF, AS WITH UNFORGIVENESS
3. Repenting, and being restored to God by the crucifying of Jesus can
only be done once.
If one has been saved, and tasted of life and come to experience the
truth,and power of God in maturity of knowledge,and then turns away from
God back to the world, one cannot be restored to the saved state again, as
that is trying to crucify Christ all over again.
Heb 6:4 For as touching those who were once enlightened and tasted of the
heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Spirit,
Heb 6:5 and tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the age to
Heb 6:6 and then fell away, it is impossible to renew them again unto
repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and
put him to an open shame.
These passages show that `once saved always saved`, and `all sins past
present and future are already forgiven through grace`, are teachings from
Do not trust them
Doug Buckley 27 Jun 2012, 06:45
I agree. Also, alot of Christians get scared because they think that their
relationship with Jesus is like a video game where they will make a wrong
move and lose salvation. Its not like this at all, but like a relationship
with a person.
The relationship is always growing and developing and trust and love are
established, but also there's forces that are working to pull us apart from
Jesus. Like any relationship there's highs and lows, and this relationship
can be violated and ruined not because of Jesus, but because of what we do
on our end.
Repentance and having a repentant heart are so important to the health of
this relationship. Repenting for our sins helps to renew the the
relationship, almost like making up.
Katherine 28 Jul 2012, 02:56
JESUS SAID THAT WE ARE UNDER GRACE, WHICH IS A FREE GIFT FROM GOD. WE
DON'T HAVE TO STRIVE TO BE RIGHTEOUS WE ARE IN CHRIST AND THERE IS
THEREFORE NOW NO CONDEMNATION TO THOSE WHO ARE IN CHRIST. WE ARE A NEW
CREATURE IN CHRIST. WE ARE RIGTHEOUS BECAUSE OF WHAT JESUS CHRIST DID NOT
BECAUSE OF WHAT WE DO. IF WE COULD STOP SINNING AUTOMATICALLY CHRIST WOULD
NOT HAVE NEEDED TO DIE. HE SAID THAT OUR FLESH WAS TOO WEAK TO KEEP THE LAW
THAT IS WHY HE CAME TO DIE TO SET US FREE FROM THE BONDAGE OF SIN THAT ADAM
PLACED US IN FROM THE VERY BEGINNING OF TIME.
stephanie Shepherd 30 Aug 2012, 03:25
1 John 1:9. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us
our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. Jesus never stops
forgiving, as long as we ask him to. For all have sinned, and come short
of the glory of God. Romans 3:23.
Tricolyn 10 Sep 2012, 06:26
I have read the other posts but i need more clarification on hebrew 6:4-6..
For 1 to get saved,the person should be convicted..salvation is not forced
onto anyone..now,considering a person who got born again at some point but
fell away and considering hebrews 6,does this mean that there is no hope of
him getting back to having a relationship with God if the person is willing
to get rid of his worldly desires?
Doug Buckley 11 Sep 2012, 08:06
Hello. You can't really make bargains with God about being saved. Either a
person knows him and has a relationship with him or they don't. Hebrews
6.6, imo, is more about mature believers, or those who have been Christians
for a long time. Notice in verse 6.7 he says the ground that *often drinks
the rain. What he is talking about are people who continually receive and
hear the word, but fail to bear any good fruit. Paul is talking more about
spiritual stagnation and choosing the world over Christ. Believers should
have growth over time, and no growth means death.
Simply put, I believe that a person cannot be saved, unsaved, and then
saved again. Highs and lows are normal, but once they are completely dead
spiritually they can't come back to Christ.
JR 08 Nov 2012, 08:59
I NEED HELP
All this conversation has been nice and all but the question on HEB 10:26
has not been answered, every site I have visited does the same thing, that
verse is popped out and it is barely answered.
I have a serious struggle with sexual impurity and that verse has killed me
over and over again, I feel like I do even know if I'm saved. I stopped
repenting because I feel it is ridiculous to repent knowing that I'll do it
again. It's bad enough I sin, I don't want to mock God in addition.
What I want to know is about Heb 10:26...please stick to the
A "Christian" that is dying.
Doug Buckley 08 Nov 2012, 23:15
Hi JR, Hebrews 10.26 says what it means and means what it says. If one who
knows the truth sins "willfully" or willingly, Christ will no longer
forgive their sins. I believe it means after a certain point we can lose
salvation. So what and how much is "willful" sinning? Well if you know
something is wrong try not to do it. However, we all sin and we all could
probably do a little better and try a little harder, so I wouldn't get to
worried about it. Alot of times people fixate on one type of sin, when
there's stubborness or anger or false teachings or something else that has
to be dealt with first before they can even begin to tackle the other sins.
Penfire 02 Jan 2013, 18:16
Willful sinning, especially sexual, either evil thoughts or fonication or
adultery, Paul teaches, is NOT to be practiced by believers AT ALL. So, one
MUST realize the gravity of such sins and seek fervantly God's forgiveness
and restoration and healing.
Think in terms of how much Christ suffered for our sins and it should cause
anyone to do what ever is required of us to turn from those things and to
replace them with righteousness. If we keep our minds focused on Christ
and keep reading His Word and being involved in things that glorify God we
Overcoming our flesh is a MUST. It is a GIFT of the Holy Spirit, which is,
"Love, joy, peace, patience, gentleness, kindness, goodness, faithfulness
AND self control..." We are NOT to be slaves to sin any longer, as Paul
also teaches, "Yield NOT your members as instruments of unrighteousness to
sin but yield your members as righteousness unto God as those who alive
from the dead...". If you keep sinning you will harden your heart against
the righteousness that Glorifies God. Scripture also says that when we sin
we are allowing sin to be our master and Jesus said we have ONE Master and
that is Himself.
Pray for the gift of self control which is really a yielding of OUR WILL to
God's Will. If we don't see sin as sin it is like an addiction and we will
go from one sin to another and thereby harden our hearts to God. We should
never let our consciences excuse our sin. We cannot afford to deceive
ourselves into thinking that somehow it is o.k. to sin when God gave His
Son to die on the cross. Jesus said, "If you love Me, keep My
commands...". These commands are summed up in two commandments, and He
gave a NEW one..."Love the Lord your God with all you heart, mind, soul and
strength, and love you neighbor as you love yourself..and the New
commandment was, "Love one another as I have loved you, therefore shall you
love one another and by this shall ALL men know you are My disciples...".
Jesus did not lessen or do away with the Law, He said not only is adultery
a sin but to look on a woman with lust in your heart is the same thing as
committing adultery...". God will truly help us to overcome any besetting
Doug Buckley 03 Jan 2013, 07:41
That's very true about sin pulling us from God, and not being in denial
Cole 16 Jan 2013, 00:24
It's just amazing to me how many people here can take the Bible out of
Please reframe from using Hebrews 10:26 as a reference. The writer here is
talking to the non believers, trust me. You people have to realize the
settings and whom is receiving the gospel at the current time.
There is no limit on sinning if you are a Christian. John 3:16. Jesus says
that the only sin that is not forgivable is blasphemy against the Holy
Spirit. And that all men will be forgiven. When Jesus talks about
repentance, he is talking about turning away from from your old ways and
accepting him as your savior. Saved from death.
People the whole point of Jesus was to save us from our sin. Many passages
are directed to the non believers "jews"
The word bretheren is referring to the jews. You can't live your entire
life anxious about your faults. However as many of you have noted, God will
turn you over to your sins and there will be consequences. There is not
limit this is the old teachings taught to scare people to Christianity.
Take homosexuals for example, they are constantly living in sin will they
go to heaven? If they believe in jesus as their savior. John 3:16.
Now you could reference 1st Corinthians when Paul is talking about about
the sexual immoral. But the fact of the matter is no one will die sinless,
Paul is preaching to the non believers again here. We all sin everyday, but
by calling upon the light of the world you shall see no darkness when you
In addition ,
Whenever you see Jesus use a word such as “perish” or “destroy,”
the original word is “apollumi.” The Greek word “apollumi” means to
“to lose, or to be lost.” It is the same word Jesus used when He said
"I was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel" (Matthew 15:24).
As a believer just because you masterbate doesn't mean you are going to
hell, don't let people scare you lol. We no longer have to follow the law
to be righteous now we are through Jesus.
Those of you who have not sinned cast the first stone. You can't lose your
salvation, if you think you've lost it then you never had it.. "Licensed to
sin" people are not true Christains. We all sin and fall short as believers
daily, at different times in our life, but if we are believers we will be
saved from death/hell. However we will all be judged as Christains. And yes
as Christains you will be held more accountable if you have know Christ,
yet you continued to sinned. Example homosexual Christian. I don't have all
my reference points and scriptures on hand but people don't live in fear of
not being saved.
Jesus came to divide and spread humanity, not to condem masturbators. But
that people may be saved by believing in him as the Christ. It's late
Doug Buckley 16 Jan 2013, 12:17
hi Cole, Most people here aren't saying that if you do x or y you will lose
salvation. We all sin and will sin, and that's being recognized. But the
point is that someone can't live it up on Friday and repent on Sunday.
You said that a "license to sin" attitude means one isn't really saved.
Scripture indicates that saved people can give up and fall away. Paul
speaks of a brother turning away.
"For Demas deserted me, LOVING the present age, and he went to
Thessalonica. Crescens went to Galatia, Titus to Dalmatia" (2 Timothy 4:10
As far as Hebrews 10.26, he's must to talking to believers because he
speaks of no more sacrifice for sins, and Christ is the only true sacrifice
Robert 21 Jan 2013, 09:26
Hi Bro Doug
Love reading all the comments, and most of all thank you for allowing us to
post. I do know that you will be blessed, for all the hard work you have
done and all the lives you have touched. Love you Bro Doug. With that said,
as you know we all have different understandings of scripiture. I like to
read what all has to say and use there scripitures plus mind, all thats in
context and then come up with my own understanding, using the complete
Heb 10:26 have been a problen to me. But after years of bible study I will
have to say Cole is right and here is why I say it (Heb 10:26 from the NLT)
When people deliberately reject Christ's offer of salvation, they reject
God's most precious gift. They ignore the leading of the Holy Spirit the
one who communicates to us God's saving love. this warnning was given to
the Jewish Christians who were tempted to reject Christ for Judaisam, but
it applies to anyone who rejects Christ for another religion or having
understood Christ's atoning work, deliberately turns away from it (see also
Num 15:30 and 31) and (Mark 3:28-30). The point is there is no other
accptable sacrifice for sin than the death of Christ on the cross. If
someone deliberately rejects the sacrifice of Christ after clearly
understanding the Good News teaching about it, then there is no way for
that person to be saved, because God has not provided any other name in all
heaven for people to call on to save them,also see (Acts 4:12). The KJ
study bible says the same thing.
Now moving on to Eternal Securty (This Is Me and what I believe from all my
studies) and God gave me the choice to believe it or not.
Can a person once saved, having received God's free gift of eternal life
and having been born into the family of God, again return exactly and
completely to the position of being a lost and guilty sinner in the eyes of
God? Of course not! The very nature of the spiritual life that has been
received—eternal—and the Divine Source and Agent of that
life—God—forbid drawing the conclusion that a saved person can ever
again be lost. "And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish;
neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand." -John 10:28 (NKJV)
This Biblical doctrine that a person who has received Jesus Christ, been
born into the family of God, and justified by faith, can never again be
lost is sometimes called eternal security. Others speak of it as the
perseverance of the saints. The latter expression might better be termed
the perseverance of God in behalf of the saints, because the security of
our salvation does not rest on us but on God—it is based on the work of
the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. I have to much on this to post,
but I will share if asked. I have it both ways, so you can make up your
own mind,... Tks again BroDoug
Oh I have nuttin to hide, not even my mail.
Doug Buckley 24 Jan 2013, 18:56
hi Robert, I appreciate your politeness, God bless. Hebrews 10.26 has come
up alot here, and it really can't be talking about people rejecting the
gospel. It must be saved people, because the whole context of the passage
is to the brethren. Paul says when "we" have come to the knowledge of the
truth, and then sin willfully, there is no longer sacrifice for sins. As
you allude to, there was not and never will be a sacrifice for sin other
than Jesus Christ, and the way we receive this sacrifice is by repentance
and believing in the "knowledge of the truth", not rituals. Hebrews is a
letter to believers who are more knowledgable about the OT, and the
fulfilling of the OT law by Jesus. There's many many other passages that
support what is being said here as well, such as 2nd Peter 2.20-22.
brian 05 Mar 2013, 18:25
hi doug is it possible to gives jesus christ your soul back
even though you think you might have gaven it to satan?
and how do you block evil from your life?
what can you say or do for jesus christ?
Doug Buckley 05 Mar 2013, 18:40
Brian, moved your question here. Jesus can rescue and heal any soul in the
world from any situation if they truly repent and believe in him. However,
once a person dies and when Jesus returns this isn't the case anymore. A
true believer can damage their relationship with him so bad that they can't
come back, but only Jesus knows this (see above posts).
It's not possible to "block" evil from your life. God tests everyone,
including believers, and the testing of our faith is worth more than gold
(1st Peter 1.7). If you're talking about the occult then yes Jesus can
close those doors. Jesus expects us to be his servants.
Robert 17 Mar 2013, 06:00
Hi Bro Doug is me again on 2 peter 2:20-22 and I know you and I have a
different understanding on parts of the Bible. Only God knows our hearts.
THE CONDEMNATION OF FALSE TEACHERS 2:20-22
This is false teachers in view here, as in the rest of the chapter, were
unsaved. They had evidently heard the gospel preached and fully understood
the apostles' teaching that Jesus Christ was both Lord and Savior, but had
rejected it. In other words, the gospel is the key to escape. Their escape
was possible because they had heard the gospel. To illustrate, suppose I
have the cure for cancer in a pill, and you have cancer. If I give you the
pill, one could say you escape your disease even though you
choose not to swallow the pill.
Their "first" state was eternal damnation without having heard the gospel,
but their "last" worse state was eternal damnation having rejected the
gospel. Greater privilege results in greater responsibility, and greater
punishment if one rejects the privilege.
Those who believe that loss of salvation is what Peter was talking about in
this verse and in verses 21 and 22 have to deal with an insuperable
problem. The problem is that such an interpretation makes Scripture
contradict Scripture ( John 3:16; 5:24; 10:28-29; .). "This passage
[2:20-22] is often quoted to prove the 'possibility of falling from grace,
and from a very high degree of it too.' But it is one of the last passages
in the Bible that should be addressed to prove that doctrine. The true
point of this passage is to show that the persons referred to never were
changed; that whatever external reformation might have occurred, their
nature remained the same; and that when they apostatized from their outward
profession, they merely acted out their nature, and showed in fact there
had been no real change."
Thank you for alowing me to post and may God Bless Robbbbbbbb
blake 05 Nov 2013, 20:14
“If your preaching of the gospel of God's free grace in Jesus Christ does
not provoke the charge from some of antinomianism, you're not preaching the
gospel of the free grace of God in Jesus Christ.”
― D. Martyn Lloyd-Jones
steve 21 Nov 2013, 09:13
All Christians are promised an inheritance, however, the inheritance can
only be collected in heaven.
1 Peter 1:3-4 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who
according to His great mercy has caused us to be born again to a living
hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 to obtain an
inheritance which is imperishable and undefiled and will not fade away,
reserved in heaven for you,
Peter said the inheritance is reserved in heaven, Christians need to go to
heaven to collect their inheritance.
Galatians 5:19-21 Now the deeds of the flesh are evident, which
are:immorality, impurity, sensuality, 20 idolatry, sorcery, enmities,
strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, disputes, dissensions, factions, 21
envying, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I
forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the
kingdom of God.
The apostle Paul was addressing the Galatian Christians when he said, "You
will not inherit the kingdom of God."
CAN CHRISTIANS GO TO HEAVEN AND CLAIM THEIR INHERITANCE WITHOUT REPENTING?
Robert 10 Jan 2014, 07:59
Does the Bible teach that all the sins of our life were forgiven at the
cross or doesn't it? Part one
Colossians 2:13-14 reads as follows, When you were dead in your sins and in
the uncircumcision of your sinful nature, God made you alive with Christ.
He forgave us all our sins, having canceled the written code, with its
regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; he took it
away, nailing it to the cross.
The Greek word translated all in this passage is pas. It means each, every,
any, all, the whole, all things, everything. This would seem to support the
claim that all sins past present and future were forgiven at the cross. It
also supports Paul's statement that at the moment of belief the Holy Spirit
was sealed within us as a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance.
And you also were included in Christ when you heard the word of truth, the
gospel of your salvation. Having believed, you were marked in him with a
seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our
inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession—to
the praise of his glory (Ephes. 1:13-14).
Taken literally, this means the Holy spirit is the down payment that
guarantees the redemption of the acquired possession (us). This guarantee
went into effect when we first believed. (By the way, for those of you who
only speak King James-ese, all translation interpretations are from the
Greek text that brought forth the King James Version.)
Now it is God who makes both us and you stand firm in Christ. He anointed
us, set his seal of ownership on us, and put his Spirit in our hearts as a
deposit, guaranteeing what is to come. (2 Cor. 1:21-22).
This tells us that God has established us as His and has placed His seal
upon us as well. A seal is meant to authenticate ownership, placing it
beyond doubt. It's similar to the brand a rancher places on his cattle. 1
Cor. 6:19 says we are no longer ours, we were bought with a price. The
price was the life of His Son Jesus. The Holy Spirit is our guarantee that
God, who acquired us, will also redeem us.
Hebrews 10:12-14 states that Jesus offered Himself as a once for all time
sacrifice for sin that has made us perfect forever.
But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he
sat down at the right hand of God. Since that time he waits for his enemies
to be made his footstool, because by one sacrifice he has made perfect
forever those who are being made holy.
Once for all time means it applies from the beginning of the Age of Man to
the end and continuously throughout. That includes the entire life of every
believer. In offering Himself as our sacrifice for sin He has made perfect
forever we who are being made Holy. This is an expansion of the writer's
claim in Hebrews 7:25 to the effect that because Jesus lives forever He is
able to save us forever. (These verses prove that all interpretations of
Hebrews 6:4-6 and Hebrews 10:26-27 that are used to deny eternal security
are incorrect on their face. The same author, writing under the inspiration
of the Holy Spirit, could not contradict himself so radically).
Notice the sacrifice made us perfect forever, even though we're still in
the process of being made Holy. That's a job that won't be finished until
Being made perfect forever is what Paul meant when he said, Therefore, if
anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has
come! (2 Cor. 5:17). The verbs here are in the past perfect tense. That
means from God's perspective this is all over and done. Paul said that by
accepting the Lord's death as payment for all our sins we've become as
righteous as God is (2 Cor. 5:21).
These statements are all consistent. Individually and collectively they
clearly show that all the sins of our life are forgiven from the moment we
first believe. And there's not a single verse in the New Testament that
contradicts, modifies, or retracts these promises. After all, how could God
guarantee our salvation from the moment of belief unless all the sins of
our life were paid for and forgiven at the cross?
But We Still Sin
So how can we reconcile this with the undeniable fact that we still sin?
Remember, in His Sermon on the Mount Jesus explained that sin begins with a
thought, whether action follows or not. Anger is as much a sin as murder,
lust is as much a sin as adultery. He could also have said coveting is as
much a sin as theft, and so on. The writer of Hebrews told us that
continuing to work to earn or keep our salvation is equivalent to breaking
the commandment to keep the Sabbath (Hebrews 4). And James said whoever
keeps the whole Law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of
breaking all of it (James 2:10). It's only by using the blood of Jesus to
wash away all the sins of our life that God could make good on His promise
to guarantee our inheritance. Here's how He does it.
Because we've been born again, God chooses to see us as the perfect being
we will be after the rapture /resurrection. He can do this because He's
outside of time. Remember, eternity is not just a lot of time. Eternity is
the absence of time altogether and God inhabits eternity (Isaiah 57:15).
Remember God telling Adam that in the day he ate from the tree of the
knowledge of good and evil he would die? (Genesis 2:17) When Adam and Eve
disobeyed, they didn't die then and there. But although they lived for
several hundred more years, they were changed from immortal to mortal on
that day. Their eventual death became a certainty and God who is outside
time saw it at the moment they sinned.
Becoming born again is the exact opposite. We didn't actually become
immortal on that day but our immortality was made certain, and from that
time on God saw us as immortal beings. He inspired Paul to write,
Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone,
the new has come! (2 Cor. 5:17). Although to us we're still much the same,
to God we became a new creation on the day we accepted the Lord's death as
payment for our sins. He now sees us as being as righteous as He is (2 Cor.
5:21). This righteousness comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who
believe (Romans 3:22).
Paul explained how God is able to do this in Romans 7:18-20. I know that
nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the
desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not
the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do—this I keep on
doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it,
but it is sin living in me that does it.
For a born again believer, God has separated the sin from the sinner. God
sees our sins as a holdover from the old us and does not consider them to
be part of the new us. (Only God can do this)
Part two next
Robert 10 Jan 2014, 08:01
How Should we Respond To This Part two
Does this mean we're free to sin all we want? Are the legalists correct in
saying that if God didn't threaten us with the loss of our salvation we
would all become the worst kind of depraved sinners? Millions of born again
believers whose lives are radically different stand as evidence to the
contrary. We all still sin from time to time but the direction and focus of
our lives is not the same as it once was, and we can testify to the fact
that we've been changed. Although Paul said everything is permissible, he
also said not everything is beneficial or constructive. Therefore we no
longer seek our own good but the good of others (1 Cor. 10:23-24) in the
hope of winning the prize for which God has called us heavenward in Christ
Jesus (Phil 3:14). Paul was not talking about his salvation, which he
already had, but rewards he hoped to receive at the Bema Seat judgment (1
Cor. 3:10-15) after the rapture.
This is why the loss of our salvation is never threatened. Our belief in
our eventual immortality matches what God has already seen for us, and in
the meantime we strive to heed Paul's advice to live up to what we have
already attained (Phil 3:16). This is our spiritual act of worship (Romans
12:1) in gratitude for what we've been freely and irrevocably given.
But what about those true believers who don't respond with gratitude and
who don't seem to have changed, living pretty much the way they did before
they were saved? Is the gift rescinded? The promise broken? The guarantee
revoked? I haven't found a single verse that threatens them in this way.
How could there be when all the sins of their life are paid for, including
the sin of ingratitude.
What I've found is that for the most part, these ungrateful souls live
defeated lives here and forfeit rewards in the hereafter. These are the
ones Paul said will still be saved but only as one escaping through the
flames (1 Cor. 3:15).
Here on Earth they have union with out fellowship, never experiencing any
intimacy with God. As a result their Christian walk consists of movement
without progress, battles without victories, and service without success.
They're on the right side of pardon but the wrong side of power, having
justification without sanctification.
Jesus described them in the parable of the sower and the seed, saying
they're like the seed that fell among thorns. It germinates and grows but
because it's choked by the thorns, it never matures to bear fruit. Because
these believers are too concerned with the ways of the world, they never
mature as Christians and never produce anything of value to the Kingdom
(Matt. 13:22). At the Bema Seat they'll stand before the Lord with nothing
to show for the incredible gift they were given because they will fave
failed to implement the wonderful plan He had for their lives.
The New Testament is crammed with admonitions and encouragement to allow
the Holy Spirit to change the focus of our lives from the things of this
world to the things of the next one, from the things we can see, which are
temporary, to the things we cannot, which are eternal (2 Cor. 4:18), to be
made new in the attitudes of our mind (Ephesians 4:23) no longer conforming
to the patterns of this world (Romans 12:2). In short, to live up to what
we've already attained (Phil. 3:16).
Some believers who fail to heed these admonitions will find themselves
having escaped judgment simply because on a single day in their otherwise
unremarkable life they made a decision that changed everything. For some it
will be the only smart decision they ever made, but they will have made it
in faith, which is all that matters (Ephesians 2:8-9) because having made
it, all the sins of their miserable existence were forgiven and they became
a child of God (John 1:12-13), adopted into His forever family (Gal.
When the time comes, those who failed to make that decision would gladly
trade the riches of the world to change places with them. But as
indescribably generous as the gift they received on that day is, it was
only the first installment on the life they could have had. Whether out of
ignorance or rebellion they turned down the rest, refusing to allow the
Holy Spirit to guide them into it, until finally the still small voice
within them could no longer be heard.
I sometimes wonder if the loss some will suffer at the Bema Seat (1 Cor.
3:15) will appear as endless warehouses of unclaimed blessing or if the
tears the Lord wipes from their eyes will be tears of regret upon learning
what they could have done through Him had they responded to the Holy
Spirit's prompting. Only time will tell. But at least, it will all be in
the past, because Rev. 21:4 goes on to say that from then on there will be
no more death or mourning or crying or pain for the old order of things
will have passed away. All their sins were forgiven from the day they first
Doug Buckley 13 Jan 2014, 19:09
I have to say that there are a lot of biblical issues that I can see where
both sides are coming from. But on the issue of all future and potential
sins being already forgiven, I don't see it. Robert's post is well though
out and articulate, but I do find the scriptures to be almost overwhelming
on this. People can certainly decide for themselves.
The bible lays out clearly what the consequences are for believers who fail
to be awake and sober and repentant in Christ. We all sin, but we must be
repentant and always trying to put Christ first.
Paul warns believers about the possibility of failing of the grace of God,
and to not be like Esau who loved the world and lost his birthright. Christ
doesn't fail but we can.
"Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of
bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be DEFILED; Lest
there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of
meat sold his birthright. For ye know how that afterward, when he would
have inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no place of
repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears (Hebrews 12:15-17 KJV
Paul didn't count himself immune to the possibility of falling either. He
says that he seeks control, so that he himself won't be castaway, a word
meaning unapproved and rejected.
"I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that
beateth the air: But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection:
lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be
a CASTAWAY" (1 Corinthians 9:26-27 KJV bible)
As some here have already noted, Jesus requires certain things of us,
forgiveness of others so that we are forgiven, and putting him before the
world. In a private conversation with his disciples Jesus explains what it
means to follow him.
"For what is a man advantaged, if he gain the whole world, and lose
himself, or be cast away? For whosoever shall be ashamed of me and of my
words, of him shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he shall come in his
own glory, and in his Father's, and of the holy angels" (Luke 9:25-26 KJV
This leads us to the importance of repentance and getting back on the right
path. Even as Jesus says to the church of Sardis. They were a dying church
in Christ's eyes, and he tells them to repent. He says that the ones who
overcome will not have their names blotted out of the book. For someone to
have their name blotted out of the book of life, it must be in the book.
"Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and
repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief,
and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee. Thou hast a few
names even in Sardis which have not defiled their garments; and they shall
walk with me in white: for they are worthy. He that overcometh, the same
shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not BLOT out his name out of
the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before
his angels" (Revelation 3:3-5 KJV bible)
Jesus says that some in Sardis haven't defiled their garments and will walk
with him in white. This is walking in white is a clear reference to the
wedding of the Lamb.
This helps explain what the pledge or "guarantee" of the Spirit is
(mentioned in Ephesians 1.13-14). The Greek word here means something
similar to a deposit. Thus it's saying that the Spirit is a deposit that
believers will be the redeemed possession of Christ, and receive an
inheritance. But like any deposit, it's not unconditional.
If we make a deposit on something and when it comes time to take
possession, the thing is defiled or ruined then the deal is off. Just like
if a man paid a dowery on a wife and she became pregnant by another, he'd
reject her, and cancel the wedding.
And this is why Paul says he wants to present the church as chaste virgins,
meaning undefiled, and undeceived. He says he fears that they might be
deceived even as Eve was. Again warning believers to not be deceived and
"For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to
one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ. But I
fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty,
so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ"
(2 Corinthians 11:2-3 KJV).
Lastly, with respect to Hebrews 12.14, it says that the one sacrifice of
Christ lasts forever for those who are being sanctified (present tense), by
it. It says nothing about the possibility of one becoming defiled. This is
the proper context and meaning of the verse.
So we should be like Paul and striving, and while the mainstream will not
accept and in many cases refuse to discuss these scriptures, they are quite
clear. We should resist sin and get back on the right path, not spiking the
ball and celebrating on the 30 yard line.
Robert 15 Jan 2014, 22:16
Thank you bro Doug for allowing me to post and yes you are right, people
can certainly decide for themselves. I just want to make one coment from
what you have said at the beginning. ("I have to say that there are a lot
of biblical issues that I can see where both sides are coming from. But on
the issue of all future and potential sins being already forgiven, I don't
When Jesus went to the cross, He paid for all your sins period, pass,
present and future. This was before you were born, this was before the
foundation of the world and He knew you would sin, we all sin. He knows we
all sin from time to time and if you say you haven't then He says you lie.
He says were all dirty as fifthy rags. God is all knowing, God is
everywhere, God is all power, God knows what you think of me right now. God
knows where you will be at this time next year. Its all about what God can
do with His awesome power and His love for us. When you have Jesus in your
heart, you will not go out and keep sining just because you can, but still
we sin. He said even if you lust of a woman, you sin and I know for a fact,
its the way they dress and put on paint to make us look. Enough said , we
all sin and there is no big sin are little sin to Him, sin is sin.
(Rom 8:28, And we know that all things work together for good to them that
love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose. 29, For whom
he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of
his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. 30, Moreover
whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he
also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.)
Paul write, Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the
old has gone, the new has come! (2 Cor. 5:17). Although to us we're still
much the same, to God we became a new creation on the day we accepted the
Lord's death as payment for our sins. He now sees us as being as righteous
as He is (2 Cor. 5:21). This righteousness comes through faith in Jesus
Christ to all who believe (Romans 3:22).
Paul explained how God is able to do this in Romans 7:18-20. I know that
nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the
desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not
the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do—this I keep on
doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it,
but it is sin living in me that does it.
For a born again believer, God has separated the sin from the sinner. God
sees us as a new person, the old person is gone, our old self is dead.
(2 Cor 5:17, Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old
things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. 18, And all
things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and
hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation; 19, To wit, that God was
in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their
trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of
reconciliation.20, Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God
did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to
God. 21, For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we
might be made the righteousness of God in him.
There is some things in the bible I do not understand, there are some I
think I understand and there are some I can not miss understand, God Bless
luv you all,, Robert
Jasen 21 Jun 2014, 16:16
Yes Ryan you have it correct. I'm sick of going to churches and hearing
how Christians should repent every Sunday. I can't improve my flesh and I
never will. To keep repenting is to say that I can do something about my
flesh. Christ doesn't want that, he wants us to rest in his finished work
on the cross. Our past present and future sins are forgiven as you said.
All I can do is rest in that. I can't get any of my sins forgiven again.
To try to keep repenting is to try to do something that Christ already did.
Christ would have to die again for me to get more forgiveness. I'm very
disappointed in pastors leading their congregations astray by teaching them
to repent. All this will do is insight the flesh and it's an impossibility
anyways. True repentance is talking about a change from a state of
unbelief to a state of belief in Christ. We are going to commit sins until
the day we die but God declares us righteous. Christianity is not a sin
management program. It's a newness of life program. The only thing we can
do when we sin now is thank God for his forgiveness like you said and pray
about Him continually teaching us in that situation so that we walk by
faith in the situation. Trying to quit a sin (repenting) will never work.
A behavior is only changed by resting in Christ not resting in our
Jasen 21 Jun 2014, 16:28
Doug. When Christ died for your sins how old were you? You weren't born
yet. All of your sins were in the future when Christ died on the cross.
Your forgiveness isn't based on when you came to Christ. It's based on
when Christ died on the cross. Christ died for all sins. That's everybody's
past present and future sins. We can't pick and choose when we want to be
forgiven. I can't sin and then ask God to forgive me and then God responds
to me, etc. It doesn't work that way. God doesn't respond to us. We
respond to him. God has initiated forgiveness for all sin, for all people,
for all time. Our response is to say thank you, and rest in that. Not to
keep trying to keep ourselves forgiven. Hopefully that clarifies the sin
Doug Buckley 24 Jun 2014, 05:34
Hi Jasen. Take a moment to understand what's being said here. I certainly
haven't said that Christians need to "initiate forgiveness" every time they
sin. I've also said repeatedly that no believer should keep asking for
forgiveness from "dead works".
What's being said here is that believers should have a repentant heart.
Repentance is feeling contrition and wanting to change from the errors of
our ways. The opposite of repentance is entitlement and self righteousness.
How can there be growth unless we are willing to recognize and repent for
sin in our lives?
Further, the idea of not resisting sin in the flesh is somewhat of a scary
thought. Paul tells us to resist sin and not let it reign in us.
"Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in
the lusts thereof...What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the
law, but under grace? God forbid. Know ye not, that to whom ye yield
yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether
of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?" (Rom 6:12,15-16 KJV
Now sin isn't overcome by our own will power, but faith in Jesus the Word
(which is what I think your getting at here). But then if someone believes
that Jesus died so they can wallow in sin, then what are the fruits of
their faith? Faith brings repentance and change even if we can't ever be
perfect. Imo, under faith there is a place for our own will.
"Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the
flesh. For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the
Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. For as many as are
led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God" (Rom 8:12-14 KJV bible)
Jasen 26 Jun 2014, 00:06
I'm not saying don't resist sin. Certainly Christians have achoice to make
once they are saved. To obey the Spirit or obey the flesh. What is your
definition of repentance? Repentance or the greek word is metaneo which
means change of mind. In scripture it is referring to an unbeliever
changing his mind about Christ, forgiveness, salvation, and receiving
Christ. I don't believe anywhere in scripture it is telling a Christian to
repent of sins. Oh some people will point out Revelations but the writer
is pointing to those that are holding to Balaam as in 2:14. which he says
he holds against them. So my point is that we have to be careful how we
use the word repentance. It's always dealing with an unbeliever to point
them to CHrist. It's not about I used to smoke and now I don't. And my
heart has been changed. I can't keep changing my heart everytime I sin.
I'd have a heart attack, because there is a lot of sin in the flesh that's
always going to be there. I'm not saying the Lord can't help us deal with
those things, but it's really abiding in the Spirit moment by moment like
an AM FM radio. We choose to whom we listen to now. If you're interested
Aaron Budgen speaks on repentance and forgiveness and many many other
topics. He was a former rabbi turned believer in Christ and is probably
one of the top three grace teachers I know. He has wonderful insights
since he was Jewish by heritage. He has teachings on forgiveness and
repentance at Living God Ministires that blow all other pastors away.
Others are People to People Ministries and Steve McVey with Grace Walk.
Most others teach a mix of law and grace. I know how christians are
though, if it's not politically correct Christianity they don't want to
hear it. Thanks for your response and our discussion.
Jasen 26 Jun 2014, 00:08
Last message was in response to Doug.
Doug Buckley 27 Jun 2014, 11:32
Hi Jasen. I wouldn't say that repentance, or to repent, is always used for
salvation. This is definitely more how it's used in the gospels. It's used
of believers in 2nd Corinthians 7.9-10, and Jesus says to 4 of the churches
in Revelation they they must repent from serious backsliding and sin.
Certainly when we're "tuned" into the Spirit he convicts us of things and
keep us from the danger of being complacent about sin, which grieves God.
Doing the salvation routine over and over is definitely not from the
lina 23 Jul 2014, 12:13
Hi guys, just 2 days Ago I have committed sexual sin...and I cried a lot
that night, wanting for that to never happen, but I was talk into it, and I
wished I could of been strong and said no, but I tried so much, and I feel
so sad now days and I want my Lord to forgive me, I love my god so much,
and the fact that I hurt him, makes me cry, I can't be in his presence now,
I feel so unclean and I really do want to be forvivenso I can't live
peacefully and move on and have him my side, I really want to be forgiven,
can you guys help me out please? I feel lost and I want this to be fixed.
lina 23 Jul 2014, 12:17
Also I have been baptize and it has been 5 years, but I been baptize early
on a young age and I felt I wasn't ready, I did it because my parents
wanted me to do so, I been told you can be baptize again when you know you
are ready, is that true?
Jasen 23 Jul 2014, 22:56
Doug what do you mean by salvation routine over and over not from the
Spirit. Can you explain what you said there, I didn't understand. In
Revelations 2:14 repentance is addressing people who were holding to the
teaching of Balaam. They were not believers in Christ. In churches we have
some people who are saved and some people who are lost. Same thing is true
in the scriptures. Just because a letter in scripture is written to a
church doesn't mean everyone in church has Christ in them. In 2Corinthians
7:9-10 It says in 10 "Godly sorrow brings repentance that leads to
salvation..." So if repentance leads to salvation this would be for an
unbeliever leading him to salvation. I still would encourage you to listen
to Aaron Budgen's teachings on forgiveness as I think it benefits every
Jasen 23 Jul 2014, 23:23
Lina, baptism is not a requirement for salvation. We are saved by
believing in the Lord Jesus period. A lot of times in scripture baptism
was used as a sign to convert people to Judaism. I would encourage you to
listen to Aaron Budgen's teachings on baptism at Livinggodministries.net.
Just click on the links on his teachings page. They are very informative.
I can't explain things the way aaron does. He is a former Jewish rabbi and
understands these things. early Christians and the apostles were still
hanging onto their Jewish heritage and believed they had to use water
baptism to convert people to Christianity because they still believed you
still had to be Jewish. They were hanging on to their jewish roots still.
Except for Paul who I believe did not baptize anyone. Aaron explains all
of that. So I wouldn't worry so much about baptism although everyone has
the freedom in Christ to do that. More importantly is to continue to rest
in the Spirit and the fact that you are a child of God. Satan wants to get
Christians focused on not feeling saved, but God sees us through the
finished work of Christ now. All of your sins have been forgiven-- past
present and future even before you came to Christ. Forgiveness and
salvation are 2 different things. We can be forgiven, in fact we are all
forgiven- Christ did that at the cross, but then as we are "in Christ we
have redemption the forgiveness of sins". This can be a little confusing
to understand. 1 John 2:2 I believe says the sins of the whole world are
forgiven. But we know that not everyone is saved. So we all have
forgiveness Christians and nonchristians alike, the question is are we
saved. Have we received the resurrected Christ.
So in terms of your situation. You are not unclean. That is a lie from
Satan. We are clean because God sees us through the righteousness of
Christ. We all sin every day. This doesn't make us unclean. You didn't
make yourself clean so how did you make yourself unclean. Christ made us
clean. I believe the Lord wants you to learn from the experience and the
pain that was caused. And continue to rest in the Spirit. Satan wants you
to believe that you are unclean and that you have to do something to get
back into the good graces of God again. God is not condemning you or us
when we sin. He simply guides our attention back to walking by faith in
Him and learn to depend on Him more each day. God still loves us and
encourages us through His Spirit. Lina you are a forgiven person. We
don't bounce back in and out of forgiveness. Jesus shouted "telestai" at
the cross which means paid in full. Our sins (all of them- past present
and future" have been paid in full. Satan wants us to base things on our
emotions and feelings. We may feel guilty but we are forgiven. There's
nothing any of us can do to get more forgiveness. "There's no forgiveness
of sins without the shedding of blood" Christ shed his blood once for all,
He is not going to do it again. In order for us to get more forgiveness
Christ would have to die again (shed His blood), and He is not going to do
that again. So be encouraged and move on in the grace of God and your
relationship with your boyfriend. Your identity is a child of God. And He
will never take that away from us regardless of how satan tries to make us
feel. So be encouraged and rest in these truths. Blessings to you.
Doug Buckley 25 Jul 2014, 02:01
Hi Jasen, as I've said there shouldn't be a continual focus on repentance
for past sins and dead works, such as with altar calls. This is the
"salvation routine". There should instead be maturation which comes from
recognizing and not making the same mistakes.
Please read Revelation ch 2-3. Jesus tells 4 of the 7 churches that they
should repent. Even in Relevation 2.14, he is not addressing certain
individuals, but the church collectively, as part of the body. One simply
can't say that whenever Jesus tells a church to repent, he is addressing
"Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain, that are ready to
DIE: for I have not found thy works perfect before God. Remember therefore
how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore
thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not
know what hour I will come upon thee. Thou hast a few names even in Sardis
which have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with me in
white: for they are worthy" (Revelation 3:2-4 KJV bible).
As far as 2nd Corinthians 7.9-10, in the whole chapter Paul is addressing
this church, and writing passionately to them as his brethren. Clearly he
knows them (v.7), and believes that they are believers. All of Paul's
letters are to other Christians, knowing that nonbelievers don't care what
Paul does describe the repentance as being "to salvation", but this is
often how the word is used in the New Testament. Salvation isn't a
completed event, rather, believers believe unto salvation. "Who are kept by
the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the
last time" (1st Peter 1:5 KJV bible).
Jasen 25 Jul 2014, 23:14
Doug, sounds like we are in agreement then about not using repentance over
and over again as an altar call. Let me ask you this- Isn't every sin we
commit or omit a past sin? I was thinking it should be for future sins as
well. I'm thinking all of our sins were past sins to us, but it's simply
all sin to Jesus since all of our sins were in the future when Christ died
for them. So I have some questions for you. If the book of Hebrews was
written to Christians why were they still repenting? Hebrews 6 talks about
this. Telling them to move on from the elementary teachings of repentance.
And then there is 6:4-8 (which I realize is digging deep now into
understanding repentance and understanding about what this passage is
talking about ). Weren't these Hebrews if they were Christians continuing
to repent of things? If they are Christians the author tells them to move
on not laying again a foundation of repentance.
Also in Revelations so why were there only a few people dressed in white
who have not soiled their clothes in Sardis if they were all believers at
Sardis. Rev 3 2-4. Shouldn't they all be dressed in white?
Yes in 2Cor 7 9-10 that is my point that Godly sorrow brings repentance
that leads to salvation it says. So he is saying that when they were
unbelievers Paul is thankful that their Godly sorrow brought them to
repentance for salvation. But you were saying this was used for believers
in 2Cor 7 9-10 in your June 27 post to me.
Let me try and understand some more about what's going on in Rev 2 I don't
read Revelations much.
Doug Buckley 29 Jul 2014, 16:14
Hi Jasen, This topics already been discussed here ad nauseum. Imo, laying a
foundation of repentance for old dead works, "salvation routine", isn't the
same as repenting for the ongoing sins that we struggle with. Imo, God will
chastise his sons to better them for his purposes. If you disagree, then
you disagree. If you think the passages I've quoted are talking about
nonbelievers repenting, then we disagree.