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Repentance for Sin and Dead Works

"Why do some Christians teach that even though Jesus took our sins away from the sight of God, we still need to repent for them? Does not the bible say that Jesus took our sins away forever, past, present, and future...?", (Question from Manny Ferreira).

Repentance is a big part of the salvation process, because as we approach the throne of God, our own faults and culpabilities are made apparent to us, "Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins" (Luke 24.47 KJV bible). When we come to recognize and repent for our sins, Christ washes them away, making us new creatures in his name. But then after we are redeemed in Christ, should repentance continue to be a part of our daily lives? The answer is yes and no.

First, we should not seek forgiveness for things we've already repented for, because we are no longer in bondage to these "dead works", "Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God" (Hebrews 6.1 KJV bible). Paul refers to the sins of our old self as dead works, because these sins are forgiven, and no longer relevant to our lives. He instructs us to move on past repentance from these old sins, and unto the meat of God's Word. This doesn't mean that we shouldn't remember, or think about, or understand these dead works, but that we shouldn't ask to be forgiven from them again and again. Re-repentance from dead works is an insult to Christ, because it implies that initially he did not fully heal us, and set us free from our sins.

On the other hand, as Christians we must always strive to maintain a humble and repentant disposition in Christ. The reality is that we are not perfect, and we will never be perfect. Only in Christ are we perfected to be received by God as his children (Ephesians 1). As fallible people who inevitably sin, it's our responsibility to resist and war against sin to prevent it from further manifesting in our lives. In Revelation, Jesus instructs the church of Sardis to repent from its sins, and turn back to him, "Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee" (Revelation 3.3 KJV bible). Many at Sardis had become derelict and fallen away from the righteous path of Christ. So Jesus' rebuke serves as a warning for all Christians to discern and resist sin before it overtakes us.

Christ gives us eyes that see, so we can recognize our sins, and improve and work on ourselves. This striving to become more Christlike is a responsibility that we have as part of our relationship with him, and not a gift like salvation, "For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God: But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned" (Hebrews 6.7-8 KJV bible). In Christ, we are forgiven from our sins, but if we refuse to recognize and confess our own sins and failings, we have rendered ourselves unusable for his purpose and plan.

Now this doesn't mean that the second a Christian sins they are out of the book, and no longer a Christian. Our inevitable sins our washed clean if we believe in and follow Christ. What is does mean is that it's not okay for us to sin, so we have to war against it in Christ, "What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?" (Romans 6.1-2 KJV bible). So it is the willful and habitual sinner, living in sin, whom the wrath of God will be upon when Christ returns to reign (Ephesians 5.3-6).

Comments

Diego      22 Mar 2011, 14:44

You mention "...we shouldn't ask to be forgiven from them again and again. Re-repentance from dead works is an insult to Christ, because it implies that initially he did not fully heal us, and set us free from our sins."

So say in my case, as I have an addiction to masturbation, I have a really guilty conscience after I commit this sin and I confess it. I wish to be turned away from this sin, but I find myself stumbling time and again. Was I fully healed the first time I repented? Shouldn't I continue to confess?

Doug Buckley      23 Mar 2011, 16:41

Hi Diego, that's a pretty good question. When you're "healed" from your sins and dead works it doesn't mean that you'll never be tempted to sin again. Instead, it means that you're free from the spiritual damage that those sins are causing. The sins are washed away so you are no longer being cursed and corrupted by them.

Being a Christian doesn't mean that you aren't tempted to sin and don't sin. We all sin everyday, especially with little things like coveting things or being angry etc. You just have to keep fighting to not sin, and Jesus will forgive you your sins, everyday. So yes, confess, recognize that you've sinned, and recommit youself. Just don't keep repenting for the things you did a long time ago and have already repented for, which is acting like you haven't been forgiven.

Part of becoming a mature Christian is knowing the sorts of triggers and false thinking that pulls us back into our old habits, and learning to nip things in the bud, before we get sucked into things we know are wrong. God bless.

Ryan      24 Apr 2011, 23:47

C'mon guys, really?! We are to be Grace-Focused, not Sin-Focused. As a guy that has already gone through the teenage stage full of raging hormones and struggles with pornography, greed and other worldly temptations, I can say that I feel your pain Diego. Once Jesus gave his life to heal our sick and dying condition, we were set free from the fear of committing sin and God's wrath that would inevitably follow. Diego your comment reminds me of a part of my life where I was definately still a babe in Christ. I wanted to do what was right and do kingdom work, however I was stuck in a rut and never-ending cycle of fear and guilt. I would fall into sin and then immediately after that sin I would ask for God's forgiveness fearful that he would strike me down or cause bad things to happen in my life if I did not repent to Him immediately. Did I have an understanding of the Grace that I had received years prior? Absolutely not! I was taught to Fear God as a literal fear like he was this guy just waiting to punish me if I was bad. That is what we are taught in society due to the Dark Ages of Christianity. However to Fear God in true translation of the word is a term that means to respect God. We are taught in church that God is like an earthly father. We are taught here that any good father disciplines his children. However, after Christ rose from the dead, his blood paid the price of any "old covenent" punishment for sins. I'm not saying that there aren't natural consequences to sin. Sure if you fornicate enough with multiple partners, eventually you will contract a disease. But God does not punish us as he did those before the cross, thanks to the sacrifice of His son. He doesn't get some sick thrill of watching us suffer. Instead, He wants us to get a revelation of His Grace that He has freely given us. I know that "I am free to live my life", as the lyrics to the song goes. Here's the Grace message in a nutshell. Not only did Jesus die to free us from our sins and spiritual consequences of our sins, he "has come that we may have life, and have it to the full" (John 10:10). "For the grace of God that brings salvation has appeared to all men. It teaches us to say No to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self- controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age, while we wait for the blessed hope— the glorious appearing of our great God and Saviour, Jesus Christ, who gave himself for us to redeem us from all wickedness and to purify for himself a people that are his very own, eager to do what is good" (Titus 2:11-14). So what teaches us to say NO to sin? The Grace of God does. Not the fear of God's wrath. All punishment, for all sin has been paid for ON THE CROSS!

"But you know that he appeared so that he might take away our sins. And in him is no sin" (1John 3:5). "For we know that our old self was crucified with him so that the body ruled by sin might be done away with,[a] that we should no longer be slaves to sin- because anyone who has died has been set free from sin" (Romans 6:6-7). "If then you were raised with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ is, sitting at the right hand of God. Set your mind on things above, not on things on the earth. For you died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God. When Christ who is our life appears, then you also will appear with Him in glory" (Colossians 3:1-4).

God not only wants us to be aware of Grace and our freedom "In Him", He also wants us to "know" Him. The word "know" translates from the Greek word "sozo". This word means to make one whole and complete - spiritually, mentally, and physically. It is also translated in other interpretations as salvation. Jesus' words are thisl; "And this is eternal life, that they may KNOW You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent" (John 17:3). When God gives us the "free" gift of Salvation, He completes us in the literal sense of the word. If we are sin focused and constantly afraid of the wrath of God, how can we truly accept the freedom that He has given us?

So Diego and whomever this is for, I challenge you to try this. Instead of sinning then asking for God's forgiveness, praise God for forgiving you already and for Jesus taking away your past, present, and future sins and paying the price so that our just God won’t have to punish us. Then….. take a deep breath. Ahhhh… smell the freedom.

Blessings,
Ryan

Doug Buckley      25 Apr 2011, 20:35

Hi Ryan, it sounds like you have some good things to say and edify other Christians with. However, it appears that the crux of your message here is that we don't have to be concerned about sin. You are certainly saying that all sins, including sins that haven't been committed yet, are already forgiven. This implies that as Christians, we just enjoy the ride.

This isn't the case. In fact, Peter warns us about where this doctrine can lead us to if we are beguiled by it,

"Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children: Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray...For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error. While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage. For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are AGAIN ENTANGLED THEREIN, AND OVERCOME, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning. For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them" (2nd Peter 2.14, 2.18-21 KJV bible).

How could their latter end be worse than their beginning if their future sins were already forgiven? Peter tells us very clearly that those who become entangled in sin after having received Christ are worse off, "But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire" (2nd Peter 2.22 KJV bible). The gospel of Christ is never a liscence to sin.

Peter also tells us to be diligent and make our calling and election sure, not forgetting were we came from, "Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall. For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ (1st Peter 1.10-11 KJV bible).

In fact there have been many Christian groups over the years that have embraced sin, even reveled in it, under the mistaken belief that they can do whatever want because they are saved in Christ.

Paul tells us to be diligent, resisting evil, "Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled; Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright. For ye know how that afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears" (Hebrews 12.15-17 KJV bible).

This is what Christ warns us about so clearly, "But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken; The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth" (Matthew 24.48-51 KJV bible).

So many churches fail to teach this nowadays because they can't keep the checks rolling in unless they tell people that they are saved no matter what they do. They whitewash the situation to make people feel better just like the false prophets in Ezekiel, "So will I break down the wall that ye have daubed with untempered morter, and bring it down to the ground, so that the foundation thereof shall be discovered, and it shall fall, and ye shall be consumed in the midst thereof: and ye shall know that I am the LORD" (Ezekiel 13.14 KJV bible).

Lastly, let me say that I am not talking about Diego here, as a pig wallowing in the mire. In fact it sounds like some people may be laying a bit of a guilt trip on him. Alot of times the biggest sins are the ones that seem to go unnoticed, "Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel" (Matthew 23.24 KJV bible).

But we need to work towards the standard that Christ gives us, "Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect" (Matthew 5.48 KJV bible). We need to fight the good fight to make our calling and election sure (1st Peter 1.10). God bless

Gilbert      05 Aug 2011, 12:55

Thanks for setting the record straight Buckley. Hebrews 12:14 states clearly that without holiness NO ONE will see God. We all became christians so we can go to heaven. If Jesus comes when i am in immorality i will not go to heaven (1corinthians6:9). All the wicked will go to hell,christian or not. For my brother Diego who is in masturbation,get out. The grace of God is enough for us to be set free. I was there and God set me free. I am not special,He will do it for you.

Tom S      10 Aug 2011, 21:57

Ryan says it well enough. Positionally we are righteous in Christ from the moment we believe. I refuse to live believing that I can be caught out by Christ's return at a moment when I have sinned and have not yet repented. That is to say that I was initially forgiven for the sins I had already comitted when I believed and then, I should have listed them all out for forgiveness. Any "new" ones by that thinking would be cause for condemnation until I confess and repent. You are close to the Roman Catholic need for absolution at death in case you missed a few sins!
At the time of Christ's death, how many of your sins were still in the future? All of them. How many were covered/ expiated? all of them. Otherwise you are going to deny the security of the believer and the keeping power of Christ.

Gilbert      11 Aug 2011, 03:39

Thanks for your comment Tom. Indeed when we receive Jesus He forgives ALL our past sins. Infact the Bible says that we become a 'new creation'. But this new creation now becomes the object of Gods' rebuke and exhortation. The epistles for instance were written to christian churches. The intention of these books is to teach christians how to live holy and righteous lives as we wait for Jesus, NOT in unrighteousness like the pagans do. (1 Thesalonians 4) God says be holy in all you do because he who called you is holy. He desires a distinction between his own and those who have not known him. There has to be a difference in our lives when we cross the salvation line. We're not perfect of course and that is why he says when we stumble we should rise, repent, learn and strive for a pure life with the help of the Holy Spirit. The doctrine of future sins being forgiven is a big lie. Infact the bible rejects deliberate and wilful sinners! (Hebrews 6:4-6, 10:24-30). Lets not misunderstand grace,it is not there as a licence to sin but as the power to enable beleivers overcome sin. I have read Christ teaching that some preachers and miracle doers will be shut out of heaven because they were evildoers. To my understanding preachers can only be christians but they did not live clean lives. Use the blood of Jesus to clean your heart and refine your salvation. Christians are called to mature (Ephesians 4) in their walk with God and He who promised is able to accomplish that purification. Be ye holy 1peter 2:14-16

Gilbert      11 Aug 2011, 04:23

The correct scripture reference to Gods' call for holiness as posted above is 1Peter 1:14-16 not 1peter 2:14-16. Apologies for the error. Other scriptures relevant to my comments include Leviticus 11:44-45, 2corintians 5:17 and Matthew 25:1-13. Blessings. Gilbert.

Tom S      11 Aug 2011, 07:39

I'd been taught that the verse about the blood of Jesus Christ cleanses us from all sin was a continuing tense--keeps on cleansing us.

Doug Buckley      12 Aug 2011, 17:39

Hi all, let me just say that I don't believe in a roller coaster ride of salvation (sin, repent, sin, repent). In fact Paul says that after a certain point its impossible to renew someone who has fallen away (Hebrews 6.6). In Christ our sins are covered every day, but Christianiy is a journey and we can back slide and fall off the path. This is why when Christ returns many will be cast into the outer darkness (Matthew 25.30).

The obvious question is at what point do our sins cause us to lose salvation? Paul gives us some idea, "For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins" (Hebrews 10.26 KJV bible). Ultimately it's between us and God, because he knows our hearts. I discussed this at length with John (see the article faith vs. works).

robert oakley      24 Aug 2011, 09:10

Hi, I have read this statements. legimnate and sincere and very important to the discussion in todays world. I would like to say a word or two. There is more to Sin than what has been expressed here and until the real identity of our enemy is revealed we will have this back and forth discussion on the position of Sin in life and how to deal with it.
Col 2:15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.So here is Sin.
Then we have Pride of Life, lust of the flesh, lust of the eyes to contend with, which is our carnal mind and natural ways. Two enemys of God being understood here in what I am saying and we have to learn to let the Spirit of Christ move in us being willing to obey his word and truth to wash us from sin and choose in Reverance to resist evil.
To fear God is to hate evil.
I could spend alot of time trying to explain more about my words here but it would take a while to do so. There is a big difference of Living in Sin and carry Sin. In Christ we have power of powers, principaltiies(sins) and if we believe in Christ is has paid for them and will deliver us present and future sins but we have to be willing to humble ourselves and confess and begin to allow Chrsit to re-new our carnal mind into the mind of Christ to be able to resist the temptor in his attemp to cause all of us to fail the grace of God. If you believe Chrsit is the Son of God and that God raised him from the dead; giving your life over to him to do his good pleasure in your life, repented and confessed a sinners life asking him to forgive you and begin a work in you with a pure heart from which God called you; revealed his Son to and accepted Him.
Then those past sins are forgiven but the future is up to us and not already planned, though God knows the path he has for you, we as human free willed beings are giving a choice to either have Christ fulling formed in us with his mind living holy and righteous, being full of light.
Or living in darkness with no life, no hope or love, full of oppression living out the devils plan in our life. God will not make you choose him and will not seperate you from your friends.
Hope this helps anyone. God bless.
If Diego really has that problem, I would tell you to find a deliverance ministry you can trust and have him deal with the perversion and sexual defilement you have been letting in your self and find postive paths to health outlets to help change your mind, its not so much the act of masterbation thats wrong its whats on your mind and are you fornicating with people in your mind. Its a natural function but if you are compulsive then it is a power of darkness causing you to commit the act which is why I mentioned deliverance which will deal with the spiritual aspect. God Bless

dennis      27 Sep 2011, 03:15

DIEGO, IT WAS IF YOU WERE DESCRIBING ME, WITH THE PROBLEM OF MASTURBATION, I TOO HAVE THIS VERY VERY BURDEN, AS I FEEL SHAME AND HATE MYSELF , AFTER KNOWINGLY COMMITTING THE ACT, I VE CONFESSED EACH WEEK TO MY PASTOR, AND FEEL EVEN MORE GUILT, AS I FEEL I HAVE NO CONTROL OVER THIS, IT CONTROLS ME, SATAN KNOW THIS OF COURSE, SO THAT IS WHERE IAM LOST, I BEG GOD TO REMOVE THESE TERRIBLE ACTIONS, AND IAM AFRAID THAT I WILL BE UNABLE TO "LIVE" MY LIFE, WITHOUT THIS RELEASE, GOD HELP ME. , DENNIS.

rebecca      03 Oct 2011, 12:25

This is very interesting. I was always taught to ask for forgiveness right away. But my friend disagrees with this as she is a preacher of free grace... and when Christ died on the cross for our sins....this means all our sin...past present and future. And I defiantly see the good in accepting that and not living in fear....it IS almost disrespectful to not acknowledge the fact that indeed we are forgiven. On the same note, as someone mentioned above...It is wise to know what your triggers are when it comes to past addictions,stumbling blocks to your old life, ect ... And when those things come us... we should turn away (or repent) To repent is a choice, choosing not to do something....So, I don't think that it's too far off to say that we SHOULD repent from some old ways of living....If we make a mistake we should recognize it and pray that we have the strength to turn away next time, and know that we are forgiven....God was once human (although perfect) but recognizes and understands our fallen nature.....We are forgiven!....but being conscience of our stumbling blocks and repenting and turning away from that is WISE!

Doug Buckley      04 Oct 2011, 14:06

Rebecca, I basically agree with what you're saying. Repenting isn't really avoiding sin, but recognizing it and regreting it after the fact.

Let's say we are like countries. When we are saved Christ takes control of the government in us. Sin is ALWAYS invading and working to overthrow the government of Christ in us. Repenting, and avoiding pitfalls and stumbling blocks makes his government more dominant in us. However its not as though if we sinned or were at a low point or forgot to repent about something we are not saved. As long as sin doesn't overthrow Christ and take back control of our lives we are saved.

jeremy kinuthia      27 Oct 2011, 15:23

every thing is done in faith so by faith we are forgiven by faith we receive our blesssing and never by works if you thing whatever you do is a sin /not a sin then it means you want to please God by your works christ saved us to restore us to the initial status god created us in he dont want us to partake from the tree of knowledge of good and evil coz that knowledge led to falling of mankind and made man worship God nit from his heart but just to be acepted before god so as a christian christ calls you to be led by the spirit of God through which you will never sertisfy the desires of the flesh if you are lid by the spirit be sure you will live a sinless life hence no repentance but if you want to exersice your'free will' you will bump in to sin not so long so just be led by the spirit do not be sin concious partake from tree of life and seek God first.REMEMBER HE CREATED YOU TO WORSHIP HIM NOT TO LOoK AFTER YOUR OWN LIFE. HE IS ABLE TO LEAD YOU IN PATHS OF RIGHTEOUSNESS. after abraham believed God it was counted to hism as righteousness let us emmulate his life for we are his descendants do you see him repent after he lied about his wife. there are many examples but if you ask God he will teach you make him alone your teacher. be blessed

AdoptedJew      30 Oct 2011, 02:06

Matthew 5:8 Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.

What does the bible say about our heart?

Jeremiah 17:9-10
9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?
10 I the LORD search the heart, I try the reins, even to give every man according to his ways, and according to the fruit of his doings.

So, we know we can't even trust ourselves. We can only depend on God and the bible to guide us and show us where we're wrong in our lives.

1 Corinthians 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth *corruption inherit incorruption*.

When you give your life to Christ, that doesn't mean you stop sinning. This is why we strive for righteousness, drawing closer and closer to God and shedding our will in the process, sacrificing ourselves to do the Father's will. Sin cannot inherit the kingdom of God. Paul preaches constantly that it is possible for one of our "brothers" to be sinning still (1 Corinthians 5:9-13, 1 Corinthians 6:9-10)

1 John 3:2-3
2 Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
3 And every man that hath this hope in him *purifieth himself*, even as he is pure.

To purify is a process of cleansing yourself from all unrighteousness. Right after that, John says...

1 John 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

It is still very much possible to sin after being saved, and if you do, you've transgressed the law. However, under the covenant of grace, we can ask for forgiveness and guidance to strive for Holiness.

1 John 3:5-10
5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

Sin CANNOT inherit the kingdom of God. This doctrine of "living in sin until we die or Christ returns" will send you straight to hell...we need to purify our hearts in THIS lifetime, otherwise, we will not inherit the kingdom of God. Ask God to show you what's in your heart that isn't of Him and HE WILL! He wants us all to inherit the kingdom but it's up to us on whether we decide to live in righteousness or not. IF Christ was to "perfect" us when He returns, then this scripture would be void.

Revelation 22:11-15
11 He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.
12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.
13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.
14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.

Just like Jesus did it in the flesh, so can we (THROUGH CHRIST). If you say it isn't possible, you call Christ a liar and our salvation is all a lie and you're wasting your time.

Live holy, live in righteousness! We inherited the kingdom of God through the unbelief of the Jews! Time is running short, and more and more of Abraham's true seed is accepting Christ. We've been adopted through their unbelief, but it will not last forever. Christ is soon to return and we do not have time to be fiddling our thumbs. God bless you all

-I already know there are three responses to what I've said. Those who will disagree and be upset, or those who will agree, or those who disagree but will pray on it and research and look it up to see if it's true. Please, do not be one of those who are lukewarm and is comfortable living in sin.-

haena      17 Nov 2011, 03:34

hi! This conversation made me jump! haha.. This is all about Sin and Forgiveness,, yeah. Praise You Lord. When Jesus died on the cross, we are not existing yet, that was 2000 years ago, and so, our sins are being not committed yet, that proves that ALL sins have been forgiven even before they were comitted. We, Believers confess our sins NOT for us to be forgiven, BUT BECAUSE WE ARE FORGIVEN.

haena      17 Nov 2011, 05:25

wait I'm not done yet .. hehe.. well, we ARE ALREADY FORGIVEN for all of our sins. We confess not for us to be forgiven again and again, we confess for us to have the realization of HOW DEEP the Forgiveness of OUR God is. God is the ALL-Knowing GOd, even before Jesus was born, He already knew that you will commit such sins TODAY, TOMORROW, and so on, but STILL He chose to sacrifice His ONE AND ONLY SON JESUS just for someone like you. Did you ever realised that TRUTH? John 3:16 -- "For God so loved the world that he gave His One and Only Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life." -- If you could just realised, God gave Jesus as our Salvation NOT because we need to be saved, BUT simply because HE SO LOVED US. He wants us to be saved. His Love is extreme. For he Himself is Love. While committing such sins, just imagine how God has forgiven you. When you stumble, don't fall away from Grace, but fall into His Grace. Jesus is our Righteousness, we are not righteous by ourselves, we can never be. Jesus is our Hollines -- "And by that will, we have been made holy through the sacrifice of the body of Jesus Christ once for all." (Heb 10:10)

Self-condemanation leads us away from God, and that condemation is the fruit of our sins.
John 16:8-11 "When He comes (the Holy Spirit), He will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment: in regard to sin because men do not believe in Me; in regard to righteousness because I AM going to the Father, where you can see me no longer; and in regard to judgment, because the prince of this world stands condenmed."
--The HS will expose the guilt of the world because men do not believe in Him, are you still belong to this world? God's only requirement is to BELIEVE IN HIS SON (read 1John3:21) Yes we will still sin as long as we live, but more than feeling the guilt, we should give more emphasis on the depth of His Mercy, Love and Forgiveness, that is if you are TRULY believing Him, because if not, guilt will swallow you wholly. The sin will either guilt you to-death, or will cause you to stand in awe -- feeling the Father's intimate and unconditional love. And if you are a true believer, here's for you -- 'in regard to righteousness because I am going to the Father....' -- If you are a TRUE believer, then the HS will CONVICT YOU of Your Righteousness which is Jesus that is sitting at the right hand of the Father, He is our Representative in Heaven, that because we Believe in His Son wholeheartedly, our Father will always be reminded of His punishment to us through His Own Son. So how could He condemned you whenever you sin? If the HS is the one who makes you feel guilty whenever you sin, then what's the use of crusifiction? Instead of reminding how heavy your sins are, He will rather remind you of HOW GREAT your Salvation is! of How loving your God is! Of how depth His Grace is! And so instead of falling away from Grace because of your sin, He will make you fall inlove more into His Grace with great awe.

Romans 5:20 " But where sin is increased, grace increased all the more..." -- Sin may bring you to the depth of God's grace, but Grace will never bring you to sin. It is the grace that will say NO to ungodliness, not your guiltness. I've been to a situation before that whenever i sin, I repented immediately (almost evry moment). Unitl God made me understood His PURE GRACE -- no effort from me. the Bible is true, Grace will teach us to say NO to sin in a way that our attention will be on His Greatness ALONE, on His Grace, on His power, on His Majesty, on His Love, all in all our focus will be on Eternal things ALONE. Wherein temptations are not so tempting anymore, where our bitterness are soaking in His sweetness, where fears are hiding in His Presence, wherein SEEKING Him is the only thing i've ever wanted.. Not even noticing that while seeking the King, His Kingdom follows me. I almost forgotten the things about sinning, and realized that my sins can't enter to His Presence. Amazing God.

Instead of seeking the commandments, His Grace taught me to seek the Commander; instead of seeking His Promises, His Grace taught me to seek the Promise-Giver; instead of seeking for the blessings, His Grace taught me to seek the Blesser.

I still sin ofcourse (lighter but still have same punishment ), but according to the Bible, NOTHING CAN sepearate me from my God. (Rom8:38-39). 2Corinthians 5:17 -- "Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come! All this is from God, who reconciled us to Himself through Christ and gave us the ministry of reconciliation: that God was reconciling the world to Himself in Christ, NOT COUNTING MEN'S SINS AGAINST THEM. And He has committed to US the MESSAGE of reconcillation." -- Just think about it, I believe that Jesus will reveal to you the Depthness of Himself.

There is only One way to avoid sin, and that is JESUS. If you are still 'enjoying' in doing some sins, BELIEVE in the NAME of your Savior. You are indeed in the working progress of your growth in Him. when you do sin, realised how He's convicting you that you are righteous-- in Him, you will cry in awe, that even though you're still sinning God still sees you righteous. Then that will be the greatest feeling you could ever have, being in His very Presence. Sinking in His Grace. He understands our nature, and He already made a way. Then gooluck to yor sins (great sins) if they could still tempt you.

One more question: Do you wash yourself before taking a bath?
He is our purifying water. Feel free to soak youself.

Let us love ourselves the way God is loving us, and we will learn to love others the way He loves them.

More Grace be upon us. I would love to read your response. ^_^

Doug Buckley      17 Nov 2011, 12:33

Hi Haena, yes, Jesus died for our sins two thousand years ago, and yes whoever believes in him will have eternal life (John 3.16), and is free from their sins. Jesus loves us, and his love is extreme to forgive us of our sins. We all agree with that, but none of that is biblical evidence that a person cannot turn away from Jesus and lose salvation.

Ultimately, what is the final authority, Jesus or a church? He is the Living Word and the bible is his book. The bible is unequivocal on this subject.

"For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are AGAIN ENTANGLED THEREIN, AND OVERCOME, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning. For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them. But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire" (2nd Peter 2.20-22 KJV bible).

"But and if that evil servant shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; And shall begin to smite his fellowservants, and to eat and drink with the drunken; The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth" (Matthew 24.48-51 KJV bible).

Jesus will not be mocked and if a believer chooses this sinful world over him they will not be saved from the consequences of their sins.

You quote Hebrews 10.10, but when the verse is looked at in context (which is critical) its actually not saying what you think it is. Its really saying that Jesus sacrificed himself ONCE on the cross, because his offering was perfect, unlike the continual animal sacrifices of the first covenant.

Paul goes on to tell us, "For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth NO MORE SACRIFICE for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries" (Hebrews 10.26-27 KJV bible).

You quote Romans 8 that nothing can separate us from the love of God in Christ, but again look at the context. Paul mentions "things" like powers and principalities. He's not saying we can't choose the world over Christ.

"For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ. But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ" (2nd Corinthians 11.2-3 KJV bible).

So there you have it. I'm not trying to scare anyone, but the reality is that believers have to take heed and keep their lamps lit like the ten virgins. Nothing can pull a believer away except for their own poor choices, and willingness to be deceived by some doctrine other than what Christ teaches in his Word.

Tom      15 Dec 2011, 14:03

I think I have Scrupulosity, and OCD. This affects my christian faith, and I believe every day I sin. For thoughts that are blasphemous.

But this gets me absolutely paranoid, that if I can't what exact thought i had that was wrong I can't repent every day when I get these thoughts.

I might lie by accident like saying, Feliz Navidad was french - i thought it was and it wasn't. So then I lied and sinned again! Then i said 'no one cares about you' to myself and got paranoid thinking i said it to the holy spirit.

I can't repent every day can I? I'm worried about turning forgiveness into something cheap and meanless, but i still need forgiveness daily. Or do I?

I'm worried i'm requiring Prayer for entry into heaven and insultnig God. Have I not already got forgiveness for future sins? can't i just thank god every day with the Lords Prayer? Which even mentioned forgive us our tresspassers.

Please help!

haena      15 Dec 2011, 20:57

Hi Tom =) Please read my previous post. I'll try to leave more comment later.

May Jesus speak to your very heart. =)

Doug Buckley      16 Dec 2011, 01:14

Hi Tom, I struggle with some of those issues myself.

We all sin every day, and it takes a true Christian to recognize that. Yes you should recognize and repent for your sins, and thank Jesus for forgiveness. However, God does not keep a laundry list of your sins that you need to repent for. It's not like if you forget to repent of one sin you're no longer a Christian. If a Christian sins the minute before they die they are still forgiven. If you are in Christ all the sins you commit are forgiven.

However, your future sins are NOT forgiven. Jesus continually heals us of our sins IF we have faith in him. The bible is clear that Christians can and do fall away. If we choose the world over Jesus, and let our light of faith die out, our sins aren't forgiven.

"And the foolish said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out" (Matthew 25.8 KJV bible).

GP      23 Dec 2011, 15:08

As I read These passages, I hear one saying all sins are forgiven, past present and future. I also hear this same one saying that increasing knowlege of the Word initiates a responce of not wanting to sin anymore, although we all do. On the other hand I hear one who says that to sin willingly after being forgiven, there is no more sacrifice for sin, although we all do. What I hear both saying is that we all sin, and we all know better and don't want to. You all are in accord. Christ said when two or more are in agreement with asking anything, I will do it for them. Pray that we all can stop sin within ourselves to the Great Father through Christ. I also hear both sides saying we must acknowlege our sins, one side says they revelle in the fact they are already forgiven and one says you have to ask to be forgiven. The fact remains that we do have to acknowlege them and from what The word has taught me, you have to ask forgiveness with a pure heart. The one says as you get closer to GOD you do not want to sin, which is true, and you are already forgiven if you acknowlege it and that means confessing it and asking for pardon. Almighty God knows beginning to end, Telling God you have sinned is the way of letting God know that you know that God knows. Christ died once for all. I have struggled with what Paul said,If you sin willingly after knowing the truth, there is no more sacrifice for sin,and quite frankly it scares the hell out of me. I don't know about anyone else but to me this is the fear of the Lord. I strive for perfection but am always found wanting in the eyes of Him who is perfection in essence. I ask for strength and knowlege but sin every day, well almost every day, but then I ask for strength and knowledge not to do it anymore and also forgivness. I don't know everything, who does but one? But I think I know the chance for freedom is given as a gift, the choice of freedom is earned. We have to make a strong effort and we get better and better at it. Grace is a gift for sure, but we have to take it from there. May the Lord give us all wisdom

tee      12 Jan 2012, 06:09

I have been saved for about a year and a half. And I fornicate at times. I know its wrong and I ask for forgiveness but I also feel so ashamed after because I don't like disappointing god. Sometimes I can sustain myself, and I can be really on track and then I fall. I read the bible a lot, fast, and pray. I thought I had a problem until a prophet said my problem was yielding. I have changed a lot of my bad habits, but this one seems the hardest. People say I'm too hard on myself, but I just want to stop this act of sin and serve the lord wholeheartedly.

Daniel      12 Jan 2012, 10:56

I read your scriptures from above.
I really disagreed for some of the interpretation.
Being in this modern world we are doing sin every movement. Bible says that by our thought also we will commit sin. Human beings are not a perfect creatures.
In our daily bases we have to repent on Him(Jesus).
It's so important to us.
Thank you

Doug Buckley      12 Jan 2012, 22:02

Hi Tee, Romans 6 talks about how we should yield our bodies to God instead of yielding to unrighteousness and sin, so repent and keep trying. For alot of Christians the root of their habitual sinning is a lack of faith, because they're not getting fed in churches.

ctincher      19 Jan 2012, 09:58

hebrews 10:26 is talking about hearing thr gospel of christ and rejecting it. if you say you are saved and continue to live your life like you did before did u truly repent? born again christians sin daily a thought can come into your mind you may say things out of anger. you can sin in your sleep. seek God daily and repent daily even hourly. not one of us is perfect.

Evangelist      27 Jan 2012, 15:53

As children of God, we have to turn away from sin, Quit, give up, Repent, seek the Lord for what ever it is that have power over you. no weapon formed against you shall prosper. Is. 54:17 the battle is not yours, it belongs to God. seek his face, He will deliver you. fast, and pray, VICTORY is yours. remember, 1 john 4;4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them; because greater is He that is within me than he that is in the world. confess Gods word to that spirit, I belong to God, I am a new creature in Christ, I am a child of the King. and I rebuke you, you have no power over me, and with God all things are possible to them that believe. I pray this will help someone to hold on to God, Pray as never before.

Sarah      20 Feb 2012, 10:51

Sometimes we find ways to justify sin. We have to see sin as it is and if we don't then we will find ourselves standing before the Lord on judgement day and he is going to say, department from me you workers of iniquity, I never knew you. Masterbation is no different than any other sin, it is nothing more than self gratification. The bible says in 2nd Corinthians 5:17 KJV "Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new." We need to change our way of thinking he tells us in Philippians 4:8 KJV "Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things." Jesus hates sin and so should we. If we want to be like Jesus and live with Jesus forever then we should make going to heaven our ultimate goal and don't let anything or anyone hinder us from going there.

TJ       17 Apr 2012, 00:04

To Tom,

I want you to know you are not the only one struggling with OCD and scrupulosity. I also struggle with it. What you must realize is that those thoughts are not your own. A normal person gets a blasphemous thought in their brain and think "What? That's not what I meant" and shrug it off. But our brains are chemically imbalanced. So when we get a thought, we obssess over it, and perform ritual prayers to cleanse us of our sin. This usually leads to fear of rethinking those thoughts, which leads to actually having those thoughts. What you need to do is, and it's not easy, but when you get those thoughts, you remind yourself that they are not yours. YOU don't want them, and it's not YOU willfully thinking them. They come into your brain and intrude against your will. There's a difference between willfully sinning and suffering with scrupulosity, where Satan throws thoughts into our heads. I really sinned earlier, not scrupulosity, which is what led me to do a search that led to this page. God is using this for our good, though I was wrong. I've accepted His forgiveness, and asked Him to reveal any unforgiveness or sin in my life, and I trust He will do it. BUT he won't do it by condemning me. (John 3:17) He will give me the sound knowledge, not "Oh no, did I sin here, or have I not forgiven them?!?" He will gently, but definitively instruct me, as He is my God and my Father. So, in short, resist those thoughts by not letting them cause you to perform those ritual prayers, but trust that if you actually sin, God will reveal it to you in peace, and not in the constant torment that Scrupulosity provides. That is not from God. Your thoughts are not from you. I hope this helps. Also, you may want to see a psychiatrist to help you with some cognitive behavioral therapy (I recommend a Christian Psychiatrist, strongly) and he/she will probably prescribe you medication that can really help, too.

God bless you, we share this struggle, but know that one day we will stand side by side looking upon God's Glory.

Doug Buckley      17 Apr 2012, 10:39

Hi TJ, that's good advice. I deal with some OCD type issues. My mind tends to dwell on and repeat things. Different people think differently, and God understands because he makes us that way. We all sin, but my thoughts are much better when I occupy my mind with scriptures.

Michael      24 Apr 2012, 10:01

Hello fellow brothers and sisters in Christ....i have read all these posts about salvation and i just wanna say that if we have to maintain our salvation by good works of righteousness then Christ died in vain and its a sad day for a babe in Christ to read these posts and at the end of it all they are left confused, sad, and unworthy....the bible is God-breathed, but also it says to rightly divide the word line upon line and precept upon precept!!! And if anybody wants to know what the will of the Father is .......read John 6:40, and that plainly says: "And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son, and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day." Jesus followers asked Him, "what shall we do , that we may work the works of God? Jesus replied "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent!" ....then Romans 4:1-8...........its all on our faith in Jesus that brings us and keeps us in right standing with God, thats why we can be confident of our eternity because He did it all and we cant add nothing to the cross!!! Peter, Paul, John,James,Mary, or whoever did not get nailed to the cross but one man, JESUS, and its in Him we live,move and have our very being! Glory to God! There is no boasting in our works...as a matter of fact our rigtheousness is as filthy rags anyway....He wants us to be perfect and holy as He is because that would shoot down anyone who thinks he has arrived as a Christian!! We have to separate Spirit from flesh also.....How are we born again according to Jesus in the book of John?? By Spirit!!! Thats how we are perfect in Christ, because that same Spirit seals us (ephesians 1:13) when we accept and believe on Jesus!!! Now the flesh is dealt with when we read Romans 12:1-2, we present our "bodies" a living sacrifice holy and acceptable to God because it is our reasonable service.....then it goes on to saying about "dont be conformed to the world but be ye transformed by the renewing of our "minds".........Now notice how it talks about our bodies and minds(FLESH) here and Jesus is saying being born again by Spirit(SPIRIT) in John 3.....we have to get an understanding of who we are in Christ and how God seees us hidden in His Son!! I read someof you kept quoting Hebrews 6:4-6 and about sinning willfully after receiving the truth.....dont you know that the first 11 chapters of Hebrews is tallking about doing away with the old covenant way of sacrifices and religious acts and turning to the excellent way and only way Jesus and the cross?? To not turn from their old testament ideas is willfull sin and there remains no more sacrifice for sin because they are putting the sacrifice Jesus made on the cross to an open shame!!! And therefore there remains no way for them to come to repentance( summarizing the quotes).....i can go on but to those out there who are struggling in a certain area in your life, dont faint and lose hope because just like Paul in Romans 7 struggled with sin, you can too but the only way to come out is to keep your eyes fixed on Jesus and what He did on the cross....Paul never stated how long it took for him to overcome but eventually he did, not by God scaring him to throw him in hell either, but by his hope in the One who overcame the world and the lusts thereof for him........Be blessed and much love to everyone

Hank Knegt      24 Apr 2012, 14:57

To whom it may concern;

To continue sinning after learning the truth about it is a very risky business.
We should not wilfully sin expecting that every sin past present and future is forgivable. Heb 10:26 says, for one doing that, there is no sacrifice left for sin.
It makes one an adversary of God, and such ones can only look forward to destruction.
This is a hard pill for most to swallow, as they prefer to hold on to a life of knowingly sinning, and being sold down the river by teaching of being forgiven for all sins past present and future. If continuing to wilfully sin ends in destruction, the sins that are forgiven are those done with out knowing they were wrong, and turning away from them when one finds out they are wrong.

Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more a sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and a fierceness of fire which shall devour the adversaries.
Heb 10:28 A man that hath set at nought Moses law dieth without compassion on the word of two or three witnesses:
Heb 10:29 of how much sorer punishment, think ye, shall he be judged worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant wherewith he was sanctified an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

Also Rom 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
Rom 6:2 God forbid. We who died to sin, how shall we any longer live therein?
...........
Repent does not mean only to feel sorry, but to turn away from and stop doing what we know is wrong.

A friend would tell you this. The enemy says "Keep on sinning knowing it is wrong and grace will save you."

A friend Hank Knegt

kevin sadler      27 Apr 2012, 12:23

Hi anyone following this blog,
I came across this blog whilst preparing a message about repentance and temptation.
At the early stages of prep I often look around at what people are saying and commenting on related topics. I have to say that what I believe God has revealed to me is that Repentance is the most amazing gift/tool that God has given us, individual and tailored to our circumstances. It is the incredible miracle that releases us from the bondage that Sin (unforgiven) can bring us into. This includes the preoccupation of those things that bring us down. Repentance is so often seen as a negative thing (because we have sinned and need to repent) Repentance to a true believer leads to liberty, freedom, joy and all other manifestations of the indwelling Christ. Why spend so much time in the murky mire when you have repented ? Humans seem to need to pay the price one way or another even when we say we believe in Christs provision. I have not quoted scripture for my reflections I dont think I need to they have all been quoted already.

Sipho       01 Jun 2012, 23:28

Guys i just wanna say thanks for posting on this page, for now i discovered things that i didn't know. Me eIther i have a problem masturbation but when i read this page, i felt transformation in my life and may God bless you guys as from now henceforth i will never be the same again in the name of Jesus!.

Regards

Sipho.

Ernest      12 Jun 2012, 20:11

Am I an Apostate unable to repent?
34 years ago I was a Born Again believer. I loved Christ and received the Holy Spirit. Over the years I ran into problems and ended up backsliding which led to me returning to a sinful lifestyle with drunkenness and womanizing, etc, for many years without repentance. I don't know how I got so bad, but I did. I regret all of this and how this has ruined my life and my faith. I lost my righteousness and fear that I have lost the Lord forever. I miss the guidance of the Spirit. I believe that I'm an Apostate beyond redemption. Is there any hope for me to be restored? Honest answers please!
1 year ago Report Abuse

Doug Buckley      14 Jun 2012, 03:33

Hi Ernest. I can't say whether or not you're an apostate or even if you were saved in the first place. I can say that Paul says that after a believer reaches a level of spiritual maturity, if they "fall away", they cannot be renewed (Hebrews 6.5-6.6). So there is a point of no return, but its hard to say what that point is and if any particular Christian has gone that far.

That being said, a person who turns to sin and falls away does this because they lack faith. So if they lack faith then deep down inside they don't care or believe that they are falling away from anything. Maybe they are superstitious, and afraid of what men have told them about going to hell. But in this age, its impossible for a nonbeliever to truly believe and understand they are unsaved.

So if you miss the Lord then seek him, and repent for your sins, and renew your relationship with him.

PWC      20 Jun 2012, 21:12

"For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins"

Paul says that after a believer reaches a level of spiritual maturity, if they "fall away", they cannot be renewed.

Those 2 scare me the most. I have been a sinner with sexual lewd thoughts, videos, pictures, etc...that I am extremely ashamed of for the past 25 years. I was baptized a few years back, and still fell back into the same trap. At some point 2 years ago, evil voices and thoughts came into my head constantly about God and Jesus, I could do nothing to get them out, it made me think God has left me. After much prayer, advice, and medicine, the thoughts stopped a few months later. I stopped the sexual garbage during that and have tried my best to keep stopping that kind of behavior. A few weeks ago I just started to feel really ashamed of my past sins, and I have repented a lot, now I feel I repented too much or the devil is making me feel past the point of repentance. I am truly sorry in my heart for sinning so long and consider that another body that was doing that vulgar stuff, and this is my new body that is forgiven. I thanked God for forgiving me and sorry for repenting over and over. Thoughts, help, and prayers would be appreciated!

hank      21 Jun 2012, 08:27

PWC;
Being baptized does not equal spiritual maturity.
In fact it is a mere beginning not an end.
Coming to maturity is not in our control.
We should strive to go there, and can, if God permits it.
If in our heart we think we are doing wrong, then one can be sure it is wrong.
We have no better friend than the Lord. He paid a sin debt for us that is so great, we could only pay for it ourselves with death eternal.
As such we ought to do what He desires of us, not because we have to but because we want to. Thus is his will done on earth by us as His will is done in heaven.
These statement can all be found in scriptures if you care to find them.
Take heart. If you think being baptized is becoming mature, then you are not in possession of mature knowledge. We should not continue sinning knowing it is sin.
How long does one keep a friend here, if one continually offends him or her?
What sin is worth hanging on to, if there is the slightest chance of losing eternal life over it?
If one strives hard to avoid evil, God will help,with a way out.
"Resist the devil and he will flee from you." Not even Satan has power to make one sin, but we have obligation to resist.
Think of the Lord as your absolute bestest friend, and love Him in return by doing what He wants, which are only things that are good for you.
Comments on being able to lose the Holy Spirit and not being able to receive it a second time above are true.


Doug Buckley      21 Jun 2012, 12:35

Hi PWC, hank makes some good points. It sounds like you're on the right track, but also a bit paranoid or overly focused on this. Your focus shouldn't be on doing this or that to be saved, but on God. He is our guide and knows if we love him or not, and leads us into repentance, and gets us into shape. It sounds like there are people around you who are pressuring you and worrying you about "being saved". God is more in control than they realize.

Paul's statement is more a warning to mature believers about being fruitless or becoming stagnant. We can become spiritually "dead", especially when we don't put Christ first. When we don't discover or grow spiritually things become old and trite and we start to lose our faith and give in more to sin. He compares this to being fruitless ground. Studying the Word is very important.

Hank      23 Jun 2012, 11:37

Doug Buckley;
Many do not realize how much salvation is in the hands of God and not ourselves.
Neither do many realize that being saved is just the beginning.

Repenting, is turning our selves from living in the worldly ways to truly seeking the Lord.
It is repentance that leads to remission of sins through the free gift of life which is in Jesus.
If repentance was not part of it then why would John have been sent to preach it.
Turning to God (repentance)does not earn us everlasting life, but we cannot get to it without turning to God.
Mar 1:2 Even as it is written in Isaiah the prophet, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, Who shall prepare thy way.
Mar 1:3 The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Make ye ready the way of the Lord, Make his paths straight;
Mar 1:4 John came, who baptized in the wilderness and preached the baptism of repentance unto remission of sins.

How do we get saved ?
Most preachers on TV say that you have to pray the prayer of salvation.
After they have prayed this prayer it is announced that they are saved.
It is not in our hands to get saved through either repentance or a prayer.
It is God who brings us to repentance in the first place. It is the Father that draws us to Jesus.
No one comes to Jesus if the Father does not draw him.
The Lord knows who has a true repenting heart and who does not.
John called some Pharisses who came to him a brood of vipers, knowing they were not there for the right reason, and had not been
drawn by God to repent, thus he asked then who had told them to come. John would not have called them vipres had they been earnestly repenting.


NO ONE CAN COME TO THE FATHER EXCEPT THROUGH JESUS
Joh 14:6 Jesus said to him, I am the true and living way: no one comes to the Father but by me.
Joh 14:7 If you had knowledge of me, you would have knowledge of my Father: you have knowledge of him now and have seen him.
My comment:

NO ONE CAN COME TO JESUS EXCEPT THE FATHER DRAW HIM.
Joh 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father that sent me draw him: and I will raise him up in the last day.
Joh 6:45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall all be taught of God. Every one that hath heard from the Father, and hath learned, cometh unto me.

This is all too wonderful. Salvation depends on no man, and is available to all men.
God himself initiates and completes it. Amen.

Hank      25 Jun 2012, 11:24

Has God forgiven us all past present and future sins?
Does what we do have an impact on staying in God's grace ?

Many say, and some on this site that all sins past present and future are forgiven.
This is not stated in the scriptures for a good reason, namely that it is not necessarily so.
Satan has taught from the beginning that sinning is ok, and the above view is just an example of it, namely that God's grace will cover anything we have done, do, and will do.
Three examples that warn against this view.
1. Shall we continue to sin so that grace may abound? Answer is no.
Rom 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
Rom 6:2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

2. If we do not forgive others their trespasses against us, God will not forgive us our trespasses. If our trespasses are not forgiven by God, then we have to pay the penalty for sinning ourselves. That penalty is death.
See the parable of the servant who was forgiven a huge debt he could not repay, and was forgiven it. Then he would not forgive another person a small debt. When the master found out, his original debt was again charged to him again and he had to pay it in full with death.
Mat 18:33 Shouldest not thou also have had compassion on thy fellowservant, even as I had pity on thee?
Mat 18:34 And his lord was wroth, and delivered him to the tormentors, till he should pay all that was due unto him. (FULL DEBT)
Mat 18:35 So likewise shall my heavenly Father do also unto you, if ye from your hearts forgive not every one his brother their trespasses.

NOT FORGIVING A BROTHER RESULTS IN NOT BEING FORGIVEN YOUR SELF BY GOD, IN WHICH CASE YOU HAVE OT PAY THE PENALTY OF SIN YOURSELF.

There are sins that are not forgivable ever, not in the past, not in the present and not in the future..
Any one committing one of these is not forgiven.
Mat 12:31 Therefore I say unto you, Every sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men; but the blasphemy against the Spirit shall not be forgiven.
HERE IS A SIN CLEARLY STATED AS NOT BEING COVERED BY GRACE. iF IT IS NOT FORGIVEN, THEN THE PENALTY HAS TO BE PAID BY ONESELF, AS WITH UNFORGIVENESS OF OTHERS.

3. Repenting, and being restored to God by the crucifying of Jesus can only be done once.
If one has been saved, and tasted of life and come to experience the truth,and power of God in maturity of knowledge,and then turns away from God back to the world, one cannot be restored to the saved state again, as that is trying to crucify Christ all over again.

Heb 6:4 For as touching those who were once enlightened and tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Spirit,
Heb 6:5 and tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the age to come,
Heb 6:6 and then fell away, it is impossible to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

These passages show that `once saved always saved`, and `all sins past present and future are already forgiven through grace`, are teachings from the enemy.
Do not trust them
Amen.


Doug Buckley      27 Jun 2012, 06:45

I agree. Also, alot of Christians get scared because they think that their relationship with Jesus is like a video game where they will make a wrong move and lose salvation. Its not like this at all, but like a relationship with a person.

The relationship is always growing and developing and trust and love are established, but also there's forces that are working to pull us apart from Jesus. Like any relationship there's highs and lows, and this relationship can be violated and ruined not because of Jesus, but because of what we do on our end.

Repentance and having a repentant heart are so important to the health of this relationship. Repenting for our sins helps to renew the the relationship, almost like making up.

Katherine      28 Jul 2012, 02:56

JESUS SAID THAT WE ARE UNDER GRACE, WHICH IS A FREE GIFT FROM GOD. WE DON'T HAVE TO STRIVE TO BE RIGHTEOUS WE ARE IN CHRIST AND THERE IS THEREFORE NOW NO CONDEMNATION TO THOSE WHO ARE IN CHRIST. WE ARE A NEW CREATURE IN CHRIST. WE ARE RIGTHEOUS BECAUSE OF WHAT JESUS CHRIST DID NOT BECAUSE OF WHAT WE DO. IF WE COULD STOP SINNING AUTOMATICALLY CHRIST WOULD NOT HAVE NEEDED TO DIE. HE SAID THAT OUR FLESH WAS TOO WEAK TO KEEP THE LAW THAT IS WHY HE CAME TO DIE TO SET US FREE FROM THE BONDAGE OF SIN THAT ADAM PLACED US IN FROM THE VERY BEGINNING OF TIME.

stephanie Shepherd      30 Aug 2012, 03:25

1 John 1:9. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. Jesus never stops forgiving, as long as we ask him to. For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God. Romans 3:23.

Tricolyn      10 Sep 2012, 06:26

I have read the other posts but i need more clarification on hebrew 6:4-6.. For 1 to get saved,the person should be convicted..salvation is not forced onto anyone..now,considering a person who got born again at some point but fell away and considering hebrews 6,does this mean that there is no hope of him getting back to having a relationship with God if the person is willing to get rid of his worldly desires?

Doug Buckley      11 Sep 2012, 08:06

Hello. You can't really make bargains with God about being saved. Either a person knows him and has a relationship with him or they don't. Hebrews 6.6, imo, is more about mature believers, or those who have been Christians for a long time. Notice in verse 6.7 he says the ground that *often drinks the rain. What he is talking about are people who continually receive and hear the word, but fail to bear any good fruit. Paul is talking more about spiritual stagnation and choosing the world over Christ. Believers should have growth over time, and no growth means death.

Simply put, I believe that a person cannot be saved, unsaved, and then saved again. Highs and lows are normal, but once they are completely dead spiritually they can't come back to Christ.

JR      08 Nov 2012, 08:59

I NEED HELP

All this conversation has been nice and all but the question on HEB 10:26 has not been answered, every site I have visited does the same thing, that verse is popped out and it is barely answered.

I have a serious struggle with sexual impurity and that verse has killed me over and over again, I feel like I do even know if I'm saved. I stopped repenting because I feel it is ridiculous to repent knowing that I'll do it again. It's bad enough I sin, I don't want to mock God in addition.

What I want to know is about Heb 10:26...please stick to the question...Hebrews 10:26

Sincerely,
A "Christian" that is dying.

Doug Buckley      08 Nov 2012, 23:15

Hi JR, Hebrews 10.26 says what it means and means what it says. If one who knows the truth sins "willfully" or willingly, Christ will no longer forgive their sins. I believe it means after a certain point we can lose salvation. So what and how much is "willful" sinning? Well if you know something is wrong try not to do it. However, we all sin and we all could probably do a little better and try a little harder, so I wouldn't get to worried about it. Alot of times people fixate on one type of sin, when there's stubborness or anger or false teachings or something else that has to be dealt with first before they can even begin to tackle the other sins.

Penfire      02 Jan 2013, 18:16

Willful sinning, especially sexual, either evil thoughts or fonication or adultery, Paul teaches, is NOT to be practiced by believers AT ALL. So, one MUST realize the gravity of such sins and seek fervantly God's forgiveness and restoration and healing.

Think in terms of how much Christ suffered for our sins and it should cause anyone to do what ever is required of us to turn from those things and to replace them with righteousness. If we keep our minds focused on Christ and keep reading His Word and being involved in things that glorify God we will overcome.

Overcoming our flesh is a MUST. It is a GIFT of the Holy Spirit, which is, "Love, joy, peace, patience, gentleness, kindness, goodness, faithfulness AND self control..." We are NOT to be slaves to sin any longer, as Paul also teaches, "Yield NOT your members as instruments of unrighteousness to sin but yield your members as righteousness unto God as those who alive from the dead...". If you keep sinning you will harden your heart against the righteousness that Glorifies God. Scripture also says that when we sin we are allowing sin to be our master and Jesus said we have ONE Master and that is Himself.

Pray for the gift of self control which is really a yielding of OUR WILL to God's Will. If we don't see sin as sin it is like an addiction and we will go from one sin to another and thereby harden our hearts to God. We should never let our consciences excuse our sin. We cannot afford to deceive ourselves into thinking that somehow it is o.k. to sin when God gave His Son to die on the cross. Jesus said, "If you love Me, keep My commands...". These commands are summed up in two commandments, and He gave a NEW one..."Love the Lord your God with all you heart, mind, soul and strength, and love you neighbor as you love yourself..and the New commandment was, "Love one another as I have loved you, therefore shall you love one another and by this shall ALL men know you are My disciples...".

Jesus did not lessen or do away with the Law, He said not only is adultery a sin but to look on a woman with lust in your heart is the same thing as committing adultery...". God will truly help us to overcome any besetting sin (s).

Doug Buckley      03 Jan 2013, 07:41

That's very true about sin pulling us from God, and not being in denial about sin.

Cole      16 Jan 2013, 00:24

It's just amazing to me how many people here can take the Bible out of context.
Please reframe from using Hebrews 10:26 as a reference. The writer here is talking to the non believers, trust me. You people have to realize the settings and whom is receiving the gospel at the current time.

There is no limit on sinning if you are a Christian. John 3:16. Jesus says that the only sin that is not forgivable is blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. And that all men will be forgiven. When Jesus talks about repentance, he is talking about turning away from from your old ways and accepting him as your savior. Saved from death.
People the whole point of Jesus was to save us from our sin. Many passages are directed to the non believers "jews"

The word bretheren is referring to the jews. You can't live your entire life anxious about your faults. However as many of you have noted, God will turn you over to your sins and there will be consequences. There is not limit this is the old teachings taught to scare people to Christianity.

Take homosexuals for example, they are constantly living in sin will they go to heaven? If they believe in jesus as their savior. John 3:16.

Now you could reference 1st Corinthians when Paul is talking about about the sexual immoral. But the fact of the matter is no one will die sinless, Paul is preaching to the non believers again here. We all sin everyday, but by calling upon the light of the world you shall see no darkness when you die.

In addition ,
Whenever you see Jesus use a word such as “perish” or “destroy,” the original word is “apollumi.” The Greek word “apollumi” means to “to lose, or to be lost.” It is the same word Jesus used when He said

"I was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel" (Matthew 15:24).

As a believer just because you masterbate doesn't mean you are going to hell, don't let people scare you lol. We no longer have to follow the law to be righteous now we are through Jesus.

Those of you who have not sinned cast the first stone. You can't lose your salvation, if you think you've lost it then you never had it.. "Licensed to sin" people are not true Christains. We all sin and fall short as believers daily, at different times in our life, but if we are believers we will be saved from death/hell. However we will all be judged as Christains. And yes as Christains you will be held more accountable if you have know Christ, yet you continued to sinned. Example homosexual Christian. I don't have all my reference points and scriptures on hand but people don't live in fear of not being saved.
Jesus came to divide and spread humanity, not to condem masturbators. But that people may be saved by believing in him as the Christ. It's late goodnight

Doug Buckley      16 Jan 2013, 12:17

hi Cole, Most people here aren't saying that if you do x or y you will lose salvation. We all sin and will sin, and that's being recognized. But the point is that someone can't live it up on Friday and repent on Sunday.

You said that a "license to sin" attitude means one isn't really saved. Scripture indicates that saved people can give up and fall away. Paul speaks of a brother turning away.

"For Demas deserted me, LOVING the present age, and he went to Thessalonica. Crescens went to Galatia, Titus to Dalmatia" (2 Timothy 4:10 LITV bible).

As far as Hebrews 10.26, he's must to talking to believers because he speaks of no more sacrifice for sins, and Christ is the only true sacrifice for sin.

Robert      21 Jan 2013, 09:26

Hi Bro Doug
Love reading all the comments, and most of all thank you for allowing us to post. I do know that you will be blessed, for all the hard work you have done and all the lives you have touched. Love you Bro Doug. With that said, as you know we all have different understandings of scripiture. I like to read what all has to say and use there scripitures plus mind, all thats in context and then come up with my own understanding, using the complete bible.

Heb 10:26 have been a problen to me. But after years of bible study I will have to say Cole is right and here is why I say it (Heb 10:26 from the NLT) When people deliberately reject Christ's offer of salvation, they reject God's most precious gift. They ignore the leading of the Holy Spirit the one who communicates to us God's saving love. this warnning was given to the Jewish Christians who were tempted to reject Christ for Judaisam, but it applies to anyone who rejects Christ for another religion or having understood Christ's atoning work, deliberately turns away from it (see also Num 15:30 and 31) and (Mark 3:28-30). The point is there is no other accptable sacrifice for sin than the death of Christ on the cross. If someone deliberately rejects the sacrifice of Christ after clearly understanding the Good News teaching about it, then there is no way for that person to be saved, because God has not provided any other name in all heaven for people to call on to save them,also see (Acts 4:12). The KJ study bible says the same thing.
Now moving on to Eternal Securty (This Is Me and what I believe from all my studies) and God gave me the choice to believe it or not.
Can a person once saved, having received God's free gift of eternal life and having been born into the family of God, again return exactly and completely to the position of being a lost and guilty sinner in the eyes of God? Of course not! The very nature of the spiritual life that has been received—eternal—and the Divine Source and Agent of that life—God—forbid drawing the conclusion that a saved person can ever again be lost. "And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand." -John 10:28 (NKJV)
This Biblical doctrine that a person who has received Jesus Christ, been born into the family of God, and justified by faith, can never again be lost is sometimes called eternal security. Others speak of it as the perseverance of the saints. The latter expression might better be termed the perseverance of God in behalf of the saints, because the security of our salvation does not rest on us but on God—it is based on the work of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. I have to much on this to post, but I will share if asked. I have it both ways, so you can make up your own mind,... Tks again BroDoug
Oh I have nuttin to hide, not even my mail.

Doug Buckley      24 Jan 2013, 18:56

hi Robert, I appreciate your politeness, God bless. Hebrews 10.26 has come up alot here, and it really can't be talking about people rejecting the gospel. It must be saved people, because the whole context of the passage is to the brethren. Paul says when "we" have come to the knowledge of the truth, and then sin willfully, there is no longer sacrifice for sins. As you allude to, there was not and never will be a sacrifice for sin other than Jesus Christ, and the way we receive this sacrifice is by repentance and believing in the "knowledge of the truth", not rituals. Hebrews is a letter to believers who are more knowledgable about the OT, and the fulfilling of the OT law by Jesus. There's many many other passages that support what is being said here as well, such as 2nd Peter 2.20-22.

brian      05 Mar 2013, 18:25

hi doug is it possible to gives jesus christ your soul back
even though you think you might have gaven it to satan?
and how do you block evil from your life?
what can you say or do for jesus christ?

Doug Buckley      05 Mar 2013, 18:40

Brian, moved your question here. Jesus can rescue and heal any soul in the world from any situation if they truly repent and believe in him. However, once a person dies and when Jesus returns this isn't the case anymore. A true believer can damage their relationship with him so bad that they can't come back, but only Jesus knows this (see above posts).
It's not possible to "block" evil from your life. God tests everyone, including believers, and the testing of our faith is worth more than gold (1st Peter 1.7). If you're talking about the occult then yes Jesus can close those doors. Jesus expects us to be his servants.

Robert      17 Mar 2013, 06:00

Hi Bro Doug is me again on 2 peter 2:20-22 and I know you and I have a different understanding on parts of the Bible. Only God knows our hearts.

THE CONDEMNATION OF FALSE TEACHERS 2:20-22

This is false teachers in view here, as in the rest of the chapter, were unsaved. They had evidently heard the gospel preached and fully understood the apostles' teaching that Jesus Christ was both Lord and Savior, but had rejected it. In other words, the gospel is the key to escape. Their escape was possible because they had heard the gospel. To illustrate, suppose I have the cure for cancer in a pill, and you have cancer. If I give you the pill, one could say you escape your disease even though you
choose not to swallow the pill.

Their "first" state was eternal damnation without having heard the gospel, but their "last" worse state was eternal damnation having rejected the gospel. Greater privilege results in greater responsibility, and greater punishment if one rejects the privilege.

Those who believe that loss of salvation is what Peter was talking about in this verse and in verses 21 and 22 have to deal with an insuperable problem. The problem is that such an interpretation makes Scripture contradict Scripture ( John 3:16; 5:24; 10:28-29; .). "This passage [2:20-22] is often quoted to prove the 'possibility of falling from grace, and from a very high degree of it too.' But it is one of the last passages in the Bible that should be addressed to prove that doctrine. The true point of this passage is to show that the persons referred to never were changed; that whatever external reformation might have occurred, their nature remained the same; and that when they apostatized from their outward profession, they merely acted out their nature, and showed in fact there had been no real change."
Thank you for alowing me to post and may God Bless Robbbbbbbb

blake      05 Nov 2013, 20:14

“If your preaching of the gospel of God's free grace in Jesus Christ does not provoke the charge from some of antinomianism, you're not preaching the gospel of the free grace of God in Jesus Christ.”

― D. Martyn Lloyd-Jones

steve      21 Nov 2013, 09:13

THE INHERITANCE

All Christians are promised an inheritance, however, the inheritance can only be collected in heaven.

1 Peter 1:3-4 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His great mercy has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 to obtain an inheritance which is imperishable and undefiled and will not fade away, reserved in heaven for you,

Peter said the inheritance is reserved in heaven, Christians need to go to heaven to collect their inheritance.

Galatians 5:19-21 Now the deeds of the flesh are evident, which are:immorality, impurity, sensuality, 20 idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, disputes, dissensions, factions, 21 envying, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

The apostle Paul was addressing the Galatian Christians when he said, "You will not inherit the kingdom of God."

CAN CHRISTIANS GO TO HEAVEN AND CLAIM THEIR INHERITANCE WITHOUT REPENTING?

Robert      10 Jan 2014, 07:59

Does the Bible teach that all the sins of our life were forgiven at the cross or doesn't it? Part one
Colossians 2:13-14 reads as follows, When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins, having canceled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross.
The Greek word translated all in this passage is pas. It means each, every, any, all, the whole, all things, everything. This would seem to support the claim that all sins past present and future were forgiven at the cross. It also supports Paul's statement that at the moment of belief the Holy Spirit was sealed within us as a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance.
And you also were included in Christ when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation. Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession—to the praise of his glory (Ephes. 1:13-14).
Taken literally, this means the Holy spirit is the down payment that guarantees the redemption of the acquired possession (us). This guarantee went into effect when we first believed. (By the way, for those of you who only speak King James-ese, all translation interpretations are from the Greek text that brought forth the King James Version.)
Now it is God who makes both us and you stand firm in Christ. He anointed us, set his seal of ownership on us, and put his Spirit in our hearts as a deposit, guaranteeing what is to come. (2 Cor. 1:21-22).
This tells us that God has established us as His and has placed His seal upon us as well. A seal is meant to authenticate ownership, placing it beyond doubt. It's similar to the brand a rancher places on his cattle. 1 Cor. 6:19 says we are no longer ours, we were bought with a price. The price was the life of His Son Jesus. The Holy Spirit is our guarantee that God, who acquired us, will also redeem us.
Hebrews 10:12-14 states that Jesus offered Himself as a once for all time sacrifice for sin that has made us perfect forever.
But when this priest had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God. Since that time he waits for his enemies to be made his footstool, because by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy.
Once for all time means it applies from the beginning of the Age of Man to the end and continuously throughout. That includes the entire life of every believer. In offering Himself as our sacrifice for sin He has made perfect forever we who are being made Holy. This is an expansion of the writer's claim in Hebrews 7:25 to the effect that because Jesus lives forever He is able to save us forever. (These verses prove that all interpretations of Hebrews 6:4-6 and Hebrews 10:26-27 that are used to deny eternal security are incorrect on their face. The same author, writing under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, could not contradict himself so radically).
Notice the sacrifice made us perfect forever, even though we're still in the process of being made Holy. That's a job that won't be finished until the rapture/resurrection.
Being made perfect forever is what Paul meant when he said, Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come! (2 Cor. 5:17). The verbs here are in the past perfect tense. That means from God's perspective this is all over and done. Paul said that by accepting the Lord's death as payment for all our sins we've become as righteous as God is (2 Cor. 5:21).
These statements are all consistent. Individually and collectively they clearly show that all the sins of our life are forgiven from the moment we first believe. And there's not a single verse in the New Testament that contradicts, modifies, or retracts these promises. After all, how could God guarantee our salvation from the moment of belief unless all the sins of our life were paid for and forgiven at the cross?
But We Still Sin
So how can we reconcile this with the undeniable fact that we still sin? Remember, in His Sermon on the Mount Jesus explained that sin begins with a thought, whether action follows or not. Anger is as much a sin as murder, lust is as much a sin as adultery. He could also have said coveting is as much a sin as theft, and so on. The writer of Hebrews told us that continuing to work to earn or keep our salvation is equivalent to breaking the commandment to keep the Sabbath (Hebrews 4). And James said whoever keeps the whole Law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it (James 2:10). It's only by using the blood of Jesus to wash away all the sins of our life that God could make good on His promise to guarantee our inheritance. Here's how He does it.
Because we've been born again, God chooses to see us as the perfect being we will be after the rapture /resurrection. He can do this because He's outside of time. Remember, eternity is not just a lot of time. Eternity is the absence of time altogether and God inhabits eternity (Isaiah 57:15). Remember God telling Adam that in the day he ate from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil he would die? (Genesis 2:17) When Adam and Eve disobeyed, they didn't die then and there. But although they lived for several hundred more years, they were changed from immortal to mortal on that day. Their eventual death became a certainty and God who is outside time saw it at the moment they sinned.
Becoming born again is the exact opposite. We didn't actually become immortal on that day but our immortality was made certain, and from that time on God saw us as immortal beings. He inspired Paul to write, Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come! (2 Cor. 5:17). Although to us we're still much the same, to God we became a new creation on the day we accepted the Lord's death as payment for our sins. He now sees us as being as righteous as He is (2 Cor. 5:21). This righteousness comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe (Romans 3:22).
Paul explained how God is able to do this in Romans 7:18-20. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do—this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
For a born again believer, God has separated the sin from the sinner. God sees our sins as a holdover from the old us and does not consider them to be part of the new us. (Only God can do this)
Part two next

Robert      10 Jan 2014, 08:01

How Should we Respond To This Part two
Does this mean we're free to sin all we want? Are the legalists correct in saying that if God didn't threaten us with the loss of our salvation we would all become the worst kind of depraved sinners? Millions of born again believers whose lives are radically different stand as evidence to the contrary. We all still sin from time to time but the direction and focus of our lives is not the same as it once was, and we can testify to the fact that we've been changed. Although Paul said everything is permissible, he also said not everything is beneficial or constructive. Therefore we no longer seek our own good but the good of others (1 Cor. 10:23-24) in the hope of winning the prize for which God has called us heavenward in Christ Jesus (Phil 3:14). Paul was not talking about his salvation, which he already had, but rewards he hoped to receive at the Bema Seat judgment (1 Cor. 3:10-15) after the rapture.
This is why the loss of our salvation is never threatened. Our belief in our eventual immortality matches what God has already seen for us, and in the meantime we strive to heed Paul's advice to live up to what we have already attained (Phil 3:16). This is our spiritual act of worship (Romans 12:1) in gratitude for what we've been freely and irrevocably given.
But what about those true believers who don't respond with gratitude and who don't seem to have changed, living pretty much the way they did before they were saved? Is the gift rescinded? The promise broken? The guarantee revoked? I haven't found a single verse that threatens them in this way. How could there be when all the sins of their life are paid for, including the sin of ingratitude.
What I've found is that for the most part, these ungrateful souls live defeated lives here and forfeit rewards in the hereafter. These are the ones Paul said will still be saved but only as one escaping through the flames (1 Cor. 3:15).
Here on Earth they have union with out fellowship, never experiencing any intimacy with God. As a result their Christian walk consists of movement without progress, battles without victories, and service without success. They're on the right side of pardon but the wrong side of power, having justification without sanctification.
Jesus described them in the parable of the sower and the seed, saying they're like the seed that fell among thorns. It germinates and grows but because it's choked by the thorns, it never matures to bear fruit. Because these believers are too concerned with the ways of the world, they never mature as Christians and never produce anything of value to the Kingdom (Matt. 13:22). At the Bema Seat they'll stand before the Lord with nothing to show for the incredible gift they were given because they will fave failed to implement the wonderful plan He had for their lives.
The New Testament is crammed with admonitions and encouragement to allow the Holy Spirit to change the focus of our lives from the things of this world to the things of the next one, from the things we can see, which are temporary, to the things we cannot, which are eternal (2 Cor. 4:18), to be made new in the attitudes of our mind (Ephesians 4:23) no longer conforming to the patterns of this world (Romans 12:2). In short, to live up to what we've already attained (Phil. 3:16).
Some believers who fail to heed these admonitions will find themselves having escaped judgment simply because on a single day in their otherwise unremarkable life they made a decision that changed everything. For some it will be the only smart decision they ever made, but they will have made it in faith, which is all that matters (Ephesians 2:8-9) because having made it, all the sins of their miserable existence were forgiven and they became a child of God (John 1:12-13), adopted into His forever family (Gal. 4:4-5).
When the time comes, those who failed to make that decision would gladly trade the riches of the world to change places with them. But as indescribably generous as the gift they received on that day is, it was only the first installment on the life they could have had. Whether out of ignorance or rebellion they turned down the rest, refusing to allow the Holy Spirit to guide them into it, until finally the still small voice within them could no longer be heard.
I sometimes wonder if the loss some will suffer at the Bema Seat (1 Cor. 3:15) will appear as endless warehouses of unclaimed blessing or if the tears the Lord wipes from their eyes will be tears of regret upon learning what they could have done through Him had they responded to the Holy Spirit's prompting. Only time will tell. But at least, it will all be in the past, because Rev. 21:4 goes on to say that from then on there will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain for the old order of things will have passed away. All their sins were forgiven from the day they first believed. (Robert)

Doug Buckley      13 Jan 2014, 19:09

I have to say that there are a lot of biblical issues that I can see where both sides are coming from. But on the issue of all future and potential sins being already forgiven, I don't see it. Robert's post is well though out and articulate, but I do find the scriptures to be almost overwhelming on this. People can certainly decide for themselves.

The bible lays out clearly what the consequences are for believers who fail to be awake and sober and repentant in Christ. We all sin, but we must be repentant and always trying to put Christ first.

Paul warns believers about the possibility of failing of the grace of God, and to not be like Esau who loved the world and lost his birthright. Christ doesn't fail but we can.

"Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be DEFILED; Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright. For ye know how that afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears (Hebrews 12:15-17 KJV bible).

Paul didn't count himself immune to the possibility of falling either. He says that he seeks control, so that he himself won't be castaway, a word meaning unapproved and rejected.

"I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air: But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a CASTAWAY" (1 Corinthians 9:26-27 KJV bible)

As some here have already noted, Jesus requires certain things of us, forgiveness of others so that we are forgiven, and putting him before the world. In a private conversation with his disciples Jesus explains what it means to follow him.

"For what is a man advantaged, if he gain the whole world, and lose himself, or be cast away? For whosoever shall be ashamed of me and of my words, of him shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he shall come in his own glory, and in his Father's, and of the holy angels" (Luke 9:25-26 KJV bible).

This leads us to the importance of repentance and getting back on the right path. Even as Jesus says to the church of Sardis. They were a dying church in Christ's eyes, and he tells them to repent. He says that the ones who overcome will not have their names blotted out of the book. For someone to have their name blotted out of the book of life, it must be in the book.

"Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee. Thou hast a few names even in Sardis which have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with me in white: for they are worthy. He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not BLOT out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels" (Revelation 3:3-5 KJV bible)

Jesus says that some in Sardis haven't defiled their garments and will walk with him in white. This is walking in white is a clear reference to the wedding of the Lamb.

This helps explain what the pledge or "guarantee" of the Spirit is (mentioned in Ephesians 1.13-14). The Greek word here means something similar to a deposit. Thus it's saying that the Spirit is a deposit that believers will be the redeemed possession of Christ, and receive an inheritance. But like any deposit, it's not unconditional.

If we make a deposit on something and when it comes time to take possession, the thing is defiled or ruined then the deal is off. Just like if a man paid a dowery on a wife and she became pregnant by another, he'd reject her, and cancel the wedding.

And this is why Paul says he wants to present the church as chaste virgins, meaning undefiled, and undeceived. He says he fears that they might be deceived even as Eve was. Again warning believers to not be deceived and defiled.

"For I am jealous over you with godly jealousy: for I have espoused you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ. But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ"
(2 Corinthians 11:2-3 KJV).

Lastly, with respect to Hebrews 12.14, it says that the one sacrifice of Christ lasts forever for those who are being sanctified (present tense), by it. It says nothing about the possibility of one becoming defiled. This is the proper context and meaning of the verse.

So we should be like Paul and striving, and while the mainstream will not accept and in many cases refuse to discuss these scriptures, they are quite clear. We should resist sin and get back on the right path, not spiking the ball and celebrating on the 30 yard line.

Robert      15 Jan 2014, 22:16

Thank you bro Doug for allowing me to post and yes you are right, people can certainly decide for themselves. I just want to make one coment from what you have said at the beginning. ("I have to say that there are a lot of biblical issues that I can see where both sides are coming from. But on the issue of all future and potential sins being already forgiven, I don't see it.)
When Jesus went to the cross, He paid for all your sins period, pass, present and future. This was before you were born, this was before the foundation of the world and He knew you would sin, we all sin. He knows we all sin from time to time and if you say you haven't then He says you lie. He says were all dirty as fifthy rags. God is all knowing, God is everywhere, God is all power, God knows what you think of me right now. God knows where you will be at this time next year. Its all about what God can do with His awesome power and His love for us. When you have Jesus in your heart, you will not go out and keep sining just because you can, but still we sin. He said even if you lust of a woman, you sin and I know for a fact, its the way they dress and put on paint to make us look. Enough said , we all sin and there is no big sin are little sin to Him, sin is sin.
(Rom 8:28, And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose. 29, For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. 30, Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.)
Paul write, Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come! (2 Cor. 5:17). Although to us we're still much the same, to God we became a new creation on the day we accepted the Lord's death as payment for our sins. He now sees us as being as righteous as He is (2 Cor. 5:21). This righteousness comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe (Romans 3:22).
Paul explained how God is able to do this in Romans 7:18-20. I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do—this I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.
For a born again believer, God has separated the sin from the sinner. God sees us as a new person, the old person is gone, our old self is dead.
(2 Cor 5:17, Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. 18, And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation; 19, To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.20, Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God. 21, For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
There is some things in the bible I do not understand, there are some I think I understand and there are some I can not miss understand, God Bless luv you all,, Robert

Jasen      21 Jun 2014, 16:16

Yes Ryan you have it correct. I'm sick of going to churches and hearing how Christians should repent every Sunday. I can't improve my flesh and I never will. To keep repenting is to say that I can do something about my flesh. Christ doesn't want that, he wants us to rest in his finished work on the cross. Our past present and future sins are forgiven as you said. All I can do is rest in that. I can't get any of my sins forgiven again. To try to keep repenting is to try to do something that Christ already did. Christ would have to die again for me to get more forgiveness. I'm very disappointed in pastors leading their congregations astray by teaching them to repent. All this will do is insight the flesh and it's an impossibility anyways. True repentance is talking about a change from a state of unbelief to a state of belief in Christ. We are going to commit sins until the day we die but God declares us righteous. Christianity is not a sin management program. It's a newness of life program. The only thing we can do when we sin now is thank God for his forgiveness like you said and pray about Him continually teaching us in that situation so that we walk by faith in the situation. Trying to quit a sin (repenting) will never work. A behavior is only changed by resting in Christ not resting in our repentance.

Jasen      21 Jun 2014, 16:28

Doug. When Christ died for your sins how old were you? You weren't born yet. All of your sins were in the future when Christ died on the cross. Your forgiveness isn't based on when you came to Christ. It's based on when Christ died on the cross. Christ died for all sins. That's everybody's past present and future sins. We can't pick and choose when we want to be forgiven. I can't sin and then ask God to forgive me and then God responds to me, etc. It doesn't work that way. God doesn't respond to us. We respond to him. God has initiated forgiveness for all sin, for all people, for all time. Our response is to say thank you, and rest in that. Not to keep trying to keep ourselves forgiven. Hopefully that clarifies the sin issue.

Doug Buckley      24 Jun 2014, 05:34

Hi Jasen. Take a moment to understand what's being said here. I certainly haven't said that Christians need to "initiate forgiveness" every time they sin. I've also said repeatedly that no believer should keep asking for forgiveness from "dead works".

What's being said here is that believers should have a repentant heart. Repentance is feeling contrition and wanting to change from the errors of our ways. The opposite of repentance is entitlement and self righteousness. How can there be growth unless we are willing to recognize and repent for sin in our lives?

Further, the idea of not resisting sin in the flesh is somewhat of a scary thought. Paul tells us to resist sin and not let it reign in us.

"Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof...What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?" (Rom 6:12,15-16 KJV bible).

Now sin isn't overcome by our own will power, but faith in Jesus the Word (which is what I think your getting at here). But then if someone believes that Jesus died so they can wallow in sin, then what are the fruits of their faith? Faith brings repentance and change even if we can't ever be perfect. Imo, under faith there is a place for our own will.

"Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God" (Rom 8:12-14 KJV bible)

Jasen      26 Jun 2014, 00:06

I'm not saying don't resist sin. Certainly Christians have achoice to make once they are saved. To obey the Spirit or obey the flesh. What is your definition of repentance? Repentance or the greek word is metaneo which means change of mind. In scripture it is referring to an unbeliever changing his mind about Christ, forgiveness, salvation, and receiving Christ. I don't believe anywhere in scripture it is telling a Christian to repent of sins. Oh some people will point out Revelations but the writer is pointing to those that are holding to Balaam as in 2:14. which he says he holds against them. So my point is that we have to be careful how we use the word repentance. It's always dealing with an unbeliever to point them to CHrist. It's not about I used to smoke and now I don't. And my heart has been changed. I can't keep changing my heart everytime I sin. I'd have a heart attack, because there is a lot of sin in the flesh that's always going to be there. I'm not saying the Lord can't help us deal with those things, but it's really abiding in the Spirit moment by moment like an AM FM radio. We choose to whom we listen to now. If you're interested Aaron Budgen speaks on repentance and forgiveness and many many other topics. He was a former rabbi turned believer in Christ and is probably one of the top three grace teachers I know. He has wonderful insights since he was Jewish by heritage. He has teachings on forgiveness and repentance at Living God Ministires that blow all other pastors away. Others are People to People Ministries and Steve McVey with Grace Walk. Most others teach a mix of law and grace. I know how christians are though, if it's not politically correct Christianity they don't want to hear it. Thanks for your response and our discussion.

Jasen      26 Jun 2014, 00:08

Last message was in response to Doug.

Doug Buckley      27 Jun 2014, 11:32

Hi Jasen. I wouldn't say that repentance, or to repent, is always used for salvation. This is definitely more how it's used in the gospels. It's used of believers in 2nd Corinthians 7.9-10, and Jesus says to 4 of the churches in Revelation they they must repent from serious backsliding and sin.
Certainly when we're "tuned" into the Spirit he convicts us of things and keep us from the danger of being complacent about sin, which grieves God. Doing the salvation routine over and over is definitely not from the Spirit.
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